Lighting for Profits - Episode 149

This week on the show we welcome Paul Jamison who specializes in guiding and empowering lawn and landscape startups on their journey from operational chaos to streamlined efficiency, ultimately leading them to achieve consistent profitability and long-lasting financial success.

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Episode Transcript

Welcome to lighting for profits. All Light. All Light All Light. Powered by Emery Allen. Get rid of your excuses. Your number one source for all things, landscape light. That's where the magic can you really scale a business? We really had to show up for each other from lighting design, install sales and marketing. You're a scaredy cat salesman. We discuss everything you need to know, to start and grow a successful landscape lighting business. What do you think a hippo has to do with your business? Right? Usually it's some weird childhood thing.

Some bully kicks your butt. I think the key factor here is trust. Here is your host, Ryan Lee all light. all light. all light. Welcome. Welcome. Welcome to the number one landscape lighting show in Atlanta. That's right. Rumor is true. It's the number one show. Well, the landscape lighting show in Atlanta. So look, if you're, if you're looking to start or grow a landscape lighting business, you're definitely in the right place. Uh We're here to educate and motivate to help you dominate today. We got an amazing show lined up.

We got the one and only Mr Paul Jamison and uh he is the host of the Green Industry podcast. So this will be interesting because this might be the first time I've actually interviewed another podcaster. So I don't know, he might try to turn the tables. I'm not really sure what's gonna happen, but one thing's for sure, I'm excited about this episode. Paul is an amazing guy. Um You see him all around uh Facebook, uh Instagram, youtube, uh the, all the trade shows I saw him at the huge, I saw him at the uh he's, he's big.

He's like he's a huge celebrity at the Equip Expo. So make sure you go see him there. Uh I'm just excited to have him on the show. So stick around. Uh He helps transform lawn and landscape start-ups from chaos to efficiency, driving profitability and long term success. So, uh it's pretty cool to see someone else uh with similar goals uh as I'm trying to do here in the green industry and uh it's gonna be, it's gonna be a lot of fun. So stick around. Uh We got him coming on in just a few minutes before we have him on.

I got a question for you. Do you ever wake up and wonder what the hell you're doing all this for? You know, maybe you've been stuck in a rut. You need some direction, uh Ever thought, man. Wouldn't it be nice if someone would just tell me what to do? Why do I have to make all the decisions, right? Uh Maybe, you know, you're capable of, of achieving more than you currently are. Maybe you just can't find that missing piece to get to that next level. I'm telling you what right now take advantage of this while you can.

I'm giving away a free strategy session for anyone who books right now. Just go to landscape lighting, secrets. com click start here, get the free case study and then book a call with me. Right now. I have some time in my schedule. I've said no to a lot of things lately. OK. A lot of people have, have asked me to be at places and do the things and I'm like, no, no, no, I want to give back to the audience. I want to give back to my community.

And uh so right now it's gonna be me. In fact, a couple of weeks ago I had a guy jump on one of these calls and I, I guess he thought I was kidding or whatever. He's like, oh, it's really, you, you thought I was like, outsourcing everything because I always talk about delegate. But uh yeah, it's, it's gonna be me. So uh right now I can't promise if you're listening to this six months from now, I can't promise it's gonna be me. But right now if you want to book a call, get that free strategy session, we'll get you some clarity and these calls are very powerful.

And so uh take advantage of this while you can, we'll find out what's working in your business, what's not and at least get you headed in the right direction. And I wanna thank uh Emery Allen for their uh their partnership. Nothing hurts a quality landscape lighting installed quite like flickering bulbs, a yellow fringe around the perimeter of the beam spread or bulbs that burn out after a few on and off cycles. So don't jeopardize your customer's experience by using a budget bulb. If you want to go out of your way to provide a world class customer experience, choose Emery Allen at the end of the day, it's what's on the inside that counts.

So make sure to take advantage of Emery Allen's world class customer service and get 10% off your first order for new clients. All you gotta do super simple. Just reach out to Tom Garber his email Tom G at Emery allen. com, just email Tom G at Emery allen. com. Mention you heard about him here on lighting for profits and he'll hook you up with the discounted contractor pricing, which is way better pricing than their website. Ok. So don't, don't waste your time going to the website. Just email Tom G at Emery allen. com.

Oh, yeah. And they have an awesome uh single source led. So your lighting projects are gonna turn out super crystal clear. All right guys. Um again, in just a couple of minutes, we've got the one, the only Mr Paul Jamison. And uh I'm excited to talk shop with him a little bit about business and the things that he's doing these trends that he's seeing in the green industry, so stick around for him. Uh, lately I've had a ton on my mind and, uh by the way, uh if, if you don't know this about me when I was running my lighting business, I was just running my lighting business.

I, I wasn't on social media. I didn't go to events. I didn't listen to podcasts. Uh, in fact, I'm pretty sure if you, if you would have just told me about some guy with a lighting podcast, I would have said, or, you know, at least even thought like, well, if he knows so much, it is so good. Why doesn't he have a lighting business? Right. And, uh, I think I've had, I think I've overheard people say that about me and, uh, and I listen, I don't get mad at the haters because I just, I just understand I get it right.

Uh, but, you know, I learned a lot by running my business and, uh, mostly the hard way and, uh, I had some big time reservations when, uh, when I was launching landscape lighting secrets. You know, I had some thoughts come to my mind like, well, who am I to tell people how to run their business? And my business certainly wasn't perfect. Uh, I didn't do everything right. But the more I tried to fight it, my soul kept telling me that I needed to do this. Ok? And honestly, I didn't know the extent of what this is.

I just knew within my heart and my soul that this was my calling. And I, I eventually went on to launch landscape lighting secrets going on like four years now. Well, about 18 months ago, I had this very similar experience. And uh you see, I have people in landscape lighting secrets that have advanced beyond the original goal. Like I had this goal of like, hey, I'm gonna help you gain freedom from your business by doubling your profits. And uh they've kind of graduated from the original curriculum, right?

And I, and I really felt strongly that I needed to build a new program for this next level. And again, the imposter syndrome kept creeping in, you know, who am I to lead these amazing people? Like, how do you lead leaders? And I'm just a guy who had a lighting business, you know, uh very similar thoughts to when I launched the original program. But the good news is my soul spoke louder than my mind. And even though I really wasn't sure who or what or where or when and how all this was gonna happen, I knew I was called to do this.

And uh so we launched lighting legends and uh lighting legends is a program built for lighting businesses that have essentially graduated from the original landscape lighting seekers curriculum. They're doing over a million dollars in revenue a year and looking to go beyond their current growth trajectory. Now, the reason I'm telling you all this is because last week I had the opportunity to uh meet with the lighting legends for a third time this year, I guess in the last 99 months, this year, nine months, 12 months, whatever. And uh the reason I want to tell you about this is because man, it was magical, the the synergy that happens when you have a group of like minded people with similar desires, similar goals is astonishing.

And you know, this, this uh entrepreneurial game can be very lonely. Um You know, your friends, your family, that the people that love you don't always necessarily support you in the way that you need support, they don't always get you right? And even other peers in the industry, they may not have your same ambition, your same goals, your same drive, right? And so I found is like whatever our our current circumstance is, is not necessarily the best for us because it's not gonna help us to grow.

Because if we were, if we, if we, if we were already around those people, then we would already be further along, right? And so, you know, most of our friends and family, they don't understand what's on your mind, what's in your heart, right? And you see, when you're part of a mastermind, the whole is greater than the sum of its parts. And that, that's a quote from Aristotle. Right. And it's, it's something that you feel and, uh, this happened to me, like I'm in a, I'm in a mastermind as well.

And, uh, it's crazy what happens in these masterminds because you go into it and you pay, you, you pay a lot of money and you spend a lot of time with this group. Right? And it's, oh, it's weird because at the end of it, at the end of these sessions, you're supposed to feel amazing. Like, yes, I'm awesome. Right. And sometimes you feel like the opposite. I remember the last time I, a few months ago I went to the mastermind that I'm a member of and I, I knew I was like, I was excited to share what my plans were for my program and, and everything else.

And I, and I was like, excited to share and everyone was just to support me and high five me and tell me I'm awesome. And then that didn't happen. They're like, what? That's the dumbest idea. Why would you do that? Why would you do that? And why don't you do this? And it, and it was, I was like, what guys I paid to be here? You're supposed to make me feel good and you don't go to these to feel good. You go to these to get better alone.

You are very weak and together you're unstoppable. And so these masterminds are like having a board of directors that are looking from the outside, they're seeing things that, that you can't see because you're so close. I mean, you're just so close to, to your business that you don't see the external factors, you don't see the things and hear the things that some of your team members may be saying or, or, or what they're thinking, right? And I wanna encourage you guys to, you know, be part of, uh of, of a mastermind, like when you go to these events, don't just go there and be solo and, and, and don't talk to anyone.

Um and when you do talk to people, like, ask them what they're doing, what are they doing to work on their business? Like be proactive and intentional with growing your business? And I'm telling you what I've, I've, you know, this, this Lighting Legends group now has been together for nine months and uh they are, they are in the process of making some major changes within their business that is gonna com completely change their organizations and uh and many are gonna see that they're leading the way in the landscape.

Lighting industry. It's, it's, it's crazy to see and uh it's not easy, it's hard. Like, you know, several of the people were in the hot seat and they had a similar experience to what I had in my mastermind where they didn't hear what they wanted to hear and, uh, that hot seat got really, really hot and so, you know, get on, get comfortable being uncomfortable. That's where true growth happens. Um And, uh I'm telling you, like, these legends are, are not just building a dream business, they're building a dream life, they're doing things that most are unwilling to do.

And, uh lastly, uh, and then we'll have, uh Paul come on here in a second. Uh One of our guest speakers uh explained it by saying you need to break your business, you need to break your business and then rebuild it. And uh the reason for that is because what got you here is not gonna get you there. You know, we all have systems and processes in place. They might not be pretty, they may not be documented, but you have a way of doing things. And the problem is when you, when you go to the next level and you start to document and you start to get crystal clear on your vision and how you do things and why you do things, the people that got you here get uncomfortable as well and they're, they're not comfortable with that, right?

And so when, when, when you start to make changes for the better of your life, your business, your community, your family, the people that got you here, a lot of times aren't willing to do those things. Because they'll say things like, wow, we didn't used to do it like that. And uh it's true, you didn't used to do it like that. But if you want to go to the next level, these are gonna be the things that are required and that there's gonna be some pain involved.

So, just wanted to share that with you is a really magical experience for me to spend this week with the lighting legends. Um And uh you know, just, just be a part of a group, you know, of course, we've got landscape lighting secrets. But even if you're not in landscape lighting secrets, there's other coaching programs, there's other groups, there's other masterminds, there's other uh events and masterminds that you can join to be a part of and it's very, very powerful because these people are not your family and friends. OK?

These are these people that have similar interests, but they, they're willing to give you the real feedback and the truth that you really need to hear and the truth hurts, right? And uh a lot of times your loved ones aren't willing to do that because they don't want to hurt you. So it doesn't mean they're bad people. They just don't want to hurt you. All right guys, enough about me. I got it all out of my system. I got the monologue out of my system. I just, I, I wanted to share that with you.

Give you guys some encouragement. Keep moving forward in your business. But now it's time to get Mr Paul on. So let's get the music going. Let me know if you guys are here live. If you're ready, let's go. What's up Mr Paul Jamison? I run my central there. Thanks, man. I appreciate you coming on here. It's fun. Uh Being the guest, I'm normally the host and worried about asking the smart questions and everything. So this is a stress free podcast in here. I know. Isn't it nice being a guest?

I've only been a guest like a handful of times, but it's, it's way cooler being a guest than the host. Yeah, I'll have to have you on my show sometime. But when you're the host, you have to worry about the, yeah, everything. Recording the sound levels, the questions. It's your mind's all over the place. So it's fun just to sit back and be able to talk. Yeah, I'm with you. I pretty much try to screw up at least once a show, you know, just to, to let people know that I'm, I'm human.

No, I try not to. But it happens once or twice. So, well, at least you're live. So, you know, if you're live or not because II, I usually don't go live. I just record it and there was an episode we did, um, where I forgot to hit record. It was, it was so embarrassing. So, so embarrassing. I went to the Toro Company in Minneapolis Flew all the way there during COVID. So everything was shut down. They came in just for this. It was the CEO son a big shot.

And, uh, anyway, I forgot we get done with the episode. I looked down on my podcasting board and it says 00000 and my face turned white. My heart sunk and everyone was looking around like, what's that mean? And I was like, well means we get to redo it. Yeah, that's good practice. Oh man. Yeah, I've, you know, II I do it live for several reasons. One because I don't want to edit anything. So like I forgot to even tell you this before we started and now we're, we're just recording anything you say can and will be used against you.

Hopefully, hopefully that's the last time you hear that in your life. OK? But uh we don't, we don't edit because I'm like, you know what? We're just gonna be the real us and if I say the wrong thing or ask the wrong question, that's OK is what's crazy in the social media. I, I watch a bunch of um I'm in some mastermind for social media and all this stuff and the new trend is no editing like that's what the top guys are doing or no editing because it was so opposite where everything was like every microsecond, you gotta be like Mr Beast, you know, and then people are like, oh, that is too much for me, the consumer.

So now the trend is no editing, just authenticity. And, uh, that's, that's what's getting into action on social media now, which is pretty cool in my opinion. Yeah, I mean, that's, that's Waco, it's gonna be easier for everybody. Yeah, you just have to be yourself. So, that's pretty easy. Well, uh, I'm excited to have you on here. Congrats, by the way, you've got your podcast. The Green Industry podcast over 12. Is it almost 1200 somewhere around episodes? 5003 something episodes? That is crazy. That is awesome, man. Congrats on your success so far.

Thanks Ryan. So cool. Um Well, let's, let's just kind of go back in time a little bit to uh to why you're even doing all this. Uh When did, when did you get your start as an entrepreneur? When did you start your first business? 2011, I started Paul Jamison lawn care. I had the ghettos cards you've ever seen off vista print? They were free and free pack. Yeah, I remember doing that. Yeah, I got the free vista print and this was so long ago. I forget what those images were on the computer.

There was a name for them. Um clip art, maybe, clip art. Yeah. So I got this little clip art lawn mower. I mean, it was about sketchy as you could look for branding and it said Paul Jameson law care and the free vista print cards were very cheap. And so I just walked around the neighborhood that I was living in, uh which wasn't the nicest neighborhood. And I put, you know, put my little um cards on people, you know, jam them in the people's mailbox or on the things I later found out you couldn't do.

But I just ignorance is bliss. Gorilla market in there. And, and it worked. I, I picked up Mr Stewart Reggie Maria, uh old less, uh, he was a retired guy. There was a character that had a big old snake in his yard. And anyway, I had, I had the most it could have been a TV show my, my customers the first summer that was 2011. I was, my prices were way too low. My equipment was raggedy. I really didn't know that much about lawn care. Like, um, I had a customer ask me some questions and they're like, should you know, should I get Zoe your bermuda?

And I was like, what's that? He looked at me like those are types of grasses. I was like, oh, well, thanks for telling me like, no, I just cut like I, all I do is just cut the, like, why do I have to know that? Yeah, I was, I mean, I, I knew nothing about lawn care. I just needed to make some money. So, so I start, I didn't start entrepreneurship because I was intentional about it. I was broke as you could broke as you can get.

And I needed to make money. So I started cutting that grass and making that cash. Love it. So, how'd that first summer go? A team dealt with my buddy, my buddy, Tyler, uh, was a college student at Kennesaw State University here in Atlanta and he was offered a summer and he actually had the legit equipment. He had a mower, uh, he had commercial, uh, steel weed eaters and blowers and he had a, he had a full set up and he had his own yards. Uh, but he would help me one day a week and then my buddy, um, David would let me use.

He had just sold his landscaping business and bought a nursery and he hadn't sold all his equipment. So he let me use some of his equipment. So that first summer I kinda patched it together, um, was not profitable whatsoever. I had to go get a job at Carrabas, Italian grill as a server, um, which I ended up doing for three years. Um, but I felt I, I started falling in love with entrepreneurship. I started falling in love with getting customers, having customers and, and learning from my mistakes.

And I thought, you know what this, this is for me. I don't, I don't wanna go get a job one day even though I had a job at Carabas because I, uh, my lawn business wasn't enough to support me because I wasn't charging enough. And I didn't have, I was making, I could tell you about all my mistakes Ryan, but I was making every mistake a rookie makes. But I fell in love with business in, in those first few years. So, so it, you, I'm assuming you kept that Carrabas job for three years while you were mowing lawns and was that the extent of it?

It was just mowing lawns? That was, that was your income? No, it started mowing lawns the first week, probably month, maybe month, one or 1.5. Maria asked me, she was like, hey, can you give me a quote for sod? And um, she had these river rock things. Um, you're in Utah. I don't know if, if they have them out there, but just like decorative rock that goes in the garden bed. And she basically wanted like a full landscape job and I had no idea what I was doing.

And I called my buddy David who sold the landscaping business and he walked me through it, you know, and that was my first job. So you should have asked her, do you want Zoya or Bermuda? I didn't even ask her. I just gave her Bermuda. Uh But that was, I think before I got asked that question, I didn't even know there was different types of grass. So, yeah, we did, we did a powder. So we did the, we did the river rocks. Um, we did, we pulled all the weeds we put in line.

I mean, we did the whole thing so quickly. I real, you know, the customers would start asking me, hey, do you do fertilizer? I was like, oh, yeah. And I did, you know, I was just, I said yes to everything. I, I joke with my buddy Jason. He's like, well, I was inside hanging up someone's picture like he said yes to everything. And I was up there cleaning the gutters. And I mean, I did, uh, my first pressure washing job is a with this house back then was 1.25 million.

Now it's over 2 million. And uh, Korean lady, she was like, can you pressure wash my house? And I was like, yeah, I was so unprofessional. I had my shirt off and I was back there in my pressure washer. I mean, it was a joke, Ryan, my, my first year, oh, it's so embarrassing even to think about how unprofessional I was, but I was like 92 degrees. Like I'll take my shirt off and I'm so, anyway, I get the pressure washer and I didn't know I, I put the red nozzle on.

I didn't know it would break a hole in the window. So I, I don't know what I'm doing. So anyway, I shoot it at her window and it goes right through her window, breaks the window $4000 and she's like, you, you broke my window. I was like, I didn't know it was gonna break and, and, and I apologized to her and then I basically told her I don't have $4000 Mrs Kim. And I was like, I don't know what to do. Like, she's like, it's $4000 to get it replaced and she's like, well, I'll tell you what my family is gonna pay for it.

But just this is a lesson like you shouldn't offer services if you don't know what you're doing. And it was so embarrassing. Um, but until to this day they're my friends, the Kims, um, they followed, I, I did their yard for 5003 years. They're very nice home and I actually just went golfing with Doctor Kim a couple weeks ago and they've been, they knew I had the right desire and intentions. I just didn't know what I was doing and they, they kind of actually took me under their wing and he would take me out to an air and kind of teach me about business a little bit.

He owns a dentistry, um, and he's a semi-retired now. But, uh, it was, it was very, it couldn't have happened at a better customer's house who is in some way sympathetic. And, um, you know, they covered the $4000 damages. That's crazy. Yeah, that'll bankrupt you quick. $250 service that costs you four grand So that wasn't the only window I broke. So I've got stories for days. Right. So, it sounds like you did all the rookie mistakes, you know, you think, well, I don't have overhead and, you know, it's only gonna take me a few hours.

So, I mean, I'll, I'll make a couple of 100 bucks. Like that sounds good. So, your pricing was off your, your, your, your processes, you were doing stuff you shouldn't have even been doing. When, when did you get to the point where you're like, like something's gotta change or you just, or you just started making changes to actually go to be like a legit business owner. Yeah, so a few mentors, Kenny uh Jamie Rich, they, they all had professional companies and, and I would uh drive for Kenny.

He had one of these Isuzu box trucks and every now and again, he, but hey, we need a driver today, the driver's license, I'll pay you good. And, and, and he had, uh he worked in a country club, Whitney Houston. She passed away. Um but she was living in there at the time and, and Usher and these guys um very, very prominent country club in Atlanta where, you know, the celebrities live. So I drive the truck around there and, and he would kind of teach me he's like, yeah, that, that property there is 900 a month.

I was like 900 a month. I'm only charging 225 a month. And he's like, uh and I'm looking, I'm like, property is the same size as the one I'm doing in the other country club. I'm working in it. So I just, I started piecing this information together from what Kenny would tell me. Um, and he would take me to Panera as well. And I asked him like, I was like, will you teach me, Jamie started teaching me. She's a Georgia Certified landscape professional and she started teaching me and then Rich Jansen, um, he does lighting as well here in Atlanta.

He invited me over for a steak dinner one night because I was out in the yard. My, my mower stopped working at a 30 inch X mark lawnmower. It stopped working and I asked him, I was like, hey, can you help me diagnose and fix this thing? Like, I don't know what's going on and he, he, you know, he's a mechanic kind of guy. So he kind of looks at it with me and he could just tell I was so stressed out and he's cool, cool as a cucumber.

He's just like having a good day, make a bunch of money, just relax, you know, and I'm just, just stressed as could be. He's like, hey, Paul, he's like, um, he's like, what's stressing you out? And I start telling him like, I just, you know, I'm robbing Peter to pay Paul. I just, you know, this customer has me paid me and I gotta pay this bill and, and I was telling him all my money problems. He's like, why don't you, uh, print out all your bank bank statements, checking account statements and, um, come on over Sunday, my, my, my wife will make your steak dinner and I'll, I'll take a look at your business and, and see if there's anything I could do to help.

He used to work for Brickman, uh which is now bright view, but he, he used to work in there, finance accounting, like he, he knew the numbers side of business. So I came over to his house Sunday night, his wife made a delicious steak meal because I walked in the house and just home cooking hit you great, great aroma. And I give him all my checking account, my, my previous year tax return, like all my financials, I just throw it on his kitchen table and he puts his glasses on and he gets his pencil out and his calculator for about probably 45 minutes to an hour.

He's literally crunching numbers. He's just crunching away and he's writing stuff down and he's just like in the state of flow, in, in the, you know, in the zone for about 45 minutes. His wife's cooking, I'm just kind of sitting there petting the dog about 103 minutes. He looks up at me and he puts his glasses on the tip of his nose and he just stares at me and it was like, time froze and he's like, Paul, he said, how are you paying all your bills? And my heart kind of sunk.

And I was like, well, I'm not really paying, I'm all on time and I, you know, I, I got a side job and I was just, you know, I was telling him things are tough. He's like, yeah, he's like, your prices aren't even anywhere close to the market average. And uh he's like, I don't know how, I don't know how you're doing it. And then effective immediately, we wrote a letter which ironically now I sell the letter. It's called the price increase letter template. But we wrote that letter that night.

And then Monday morning, I, I put it in everyone's mailbox. II, I raised my prices astronomically on all my customers. Like I say, I was doing 225 a month. I raised it to $400 month. And I just told him like, hey, I didn't know what I was doing. I gotta, I gotta run my business more professionally if I'm going to do this long term. And a few of them left, most of them were like, yeah, we're waiting for you to raise your prices. And like, um, so that, that dinner with Rich changed my business.

It changed my life because I actually had somebody who worked at Bright View who knew the thing, you know, showing him all my banking information is like being butt naked in front of someone. It's like he sees everything and, and he recognized that I was not charging enough, um, at, not even close. And so once I raised my prices that changed everything, I was able to quit Carrabas, I was able to do lawn care full time and, and actually turn a profit. So, um, my, my issue was just, the prices were way too low and I didn't know because other trucks in the trucks, I just kind of charge what they were charging.

And obviously they're not around to, to, to share the turnaround story like me, eventually they had to go do something else. Wow, that's all I appreciate you sharing that. I, I love that you actually, I don't love that you almost failed, but I love that pricing was like the number one thing because that was in my experience, the same thing. And it's the number one thing I help in my coaching program is with, with pricing because of several reasons. Number one, it's the easiest lever to pull.

It's like you don't have to hire more people. You don't have to invest in more marketing. Like it's, you can just change, you can just do your letter and just tell people I'm just raising my price. And uh, you know, you're, when you really understand that you're doing a disservice to your client, to yourself, to your family, to your community by, by being the guy that's the low price. Like, because if you would have gone out of business now, you had a customer base that was relying on you to cut their lawn every single week and now what?

They gotta go find someone else, you know, or maybe if you like a lot of guys just stop answering phone calls, you know, if there's an issue or whatever, so you can't deliver the red carpet white glove experience on a budget price. It just, it just doesn't happen, right? So yeah, it's really cool to see that. You figured that out. What would you say? Like how many people dropped you when you raised your price? Uh Martina, I mean, I could tell you the people's names. I man, I was, I was mad at him.

I was like, oh come on, you know, your yard looking like a golf course because I did, I did good work. We real mode which is uh you cut it like a putting green and, and uh I I these places were looking for this is I did it in a fancy country club. So Martine, she was so rich. Uh they made 250,000 a month. You could go online and see what her husband was making a month, a month, not a year a month. Um He made 3.6 million a year o on, you know, that that's not the bonus and everything.

It was just a salary online. So I thought there's no way she's gonna cancel and she canceled her and then they had like she had like a second house that they rented out. So she canceled both houses. I had another lady cancel. Uh she was from Canada and uh I just a few honestly and, and the other people were understanding and I was like family. I mean, people, people like me and, and even kind of told me like, yeah, we thought your price were a little low but, you know, we weren't gonna say nothing.

And um, so, so yeah, and then everyone else like the new people that came in, it was just crazy. I just was mind blown when I would quote someone $400 and then they would be like, cool, you know, when can you get started? And I'm just like, what, what like I was charging 225 was my, my rate the first few years and now of a sudden they're basically paying me double and they're still not saying no, like what if I charge 450? You know what I mean? Like what, when, when someone gonna say no, I was that underpriced.

So, uh just a few dropped when I raised the prices and then a lot of the new customers paid the new prices, um, from, from, you know, starting day one. Yeah, that's awesome. Well, you know, even, even if you're not going to double your price. Like a lot of people are like, yeah, that's that, I'm sure that works for you. You're in a country club. I can't double my price, whatever. So, like the, the numbers work out like this. If you raise your price by 10% you can afford to lose up to 80203% of your clients and still make the exact same amount of money, which I don't even think you lost 20% and you did way more than 10% increase.

So your profitability went through the roof. Right. Yeah, but I was just getting back to market average. Like me raising my prices, 50% wasn't really raising 50%. I mean, for me it was, but it was getting me back to what, um, the, you know, the bright views and the Russells and the Gibbs and the, these big multimillion dollar companies, Crab Apple, these companies are in the same neighborhood I was and that I basically started charging what they were charging. Um, all right. So what did that allow you to do?

You had now you, you quit your job, you could focus on this. What, what, what were some of the next steps? Yeah, the 2015, 1617 things just flourished like crazy. Um, most of my customers were Atlanta Falcons coaches players, we were doing the head coach, defense coordinator, star players that are on the billboard. Like, um, I was hanging out with the team. But literally, I would drive the defensive coordinator's wife to the game and then I drive him home after the game, which was super cool because I liked football and they were in the NFC championship that year and I was so nervous.

I, I was literally fasting and praying. I didn't eat all day because I was like, if they lose and, and don't go to the Super Bowl and I got to drive the coach home after the game because his wife likes to drink. I was just like, dear God, please help the Falcons win. Please help the Falcons win. Please help the Falcons win and they won. They went to the Super Bowl. I was down, you know, I wasn't drinking the champagne but we're in the parking lot, you know, popping the champagne to the player.

It was wild. So, so I was around high end clients, high end homes and uh it, it was, it was just amazing um to, to be around those people, it taught me a lot about business, not just the NFL guys, but just being around rich people. Um I learned a lot of how these people live their lives and the way they think and, and how they budget their time and, and it was, it was awesome. I was in a country club for a little over 10 years. Um go through the gates in the morning and I'd leave in the leave in the afternoon.

Um and, and I learned a lot from a decade being in a high end country club, living around the not living but, you know, working around the 1%. I, I just learned a lot. These people have their Lamborghinis and Ferraris stacked on each other in the garage and it's just, it, uh, it got me into serving high end customers when I really was professional and, and taking my business serious. So it was awesome. Nice. It's very cool. So what when it up, what ended up happening with that business?

And how do you transition out of that and into what you're doing now? 2018, August, my buddy Brian ring up in Minneapolis said, hey, Paulie, he said I got a, uh a, a lawn of 203 inch lawnmower, brand new engine, basically brand new mower. Um If you want it, I'll give it to you because they, they had a fleet of so many mowers and I was griping and complaining I need a new mower. He's like, hey, they don't spend money on a mower. I, I got one just sitting in the backyard, brand new engine.

Um He was like in, I got a, I got a trailer you, you can just come fly in and pick it up and, and, and rent a car and just connected, I'll give you the trailer, I'll give you the mower and drive it back. And I was like, that's like, you know, $15,000 gift, you know, and I was gonna go spend 15,000. So I was like, well, I'll, you know, I'll get a $300 plane ticket or whatever. It was like $350 plane ticket one way to Minneapolis. So I go there, get bit by mosquitoes like I've never had in my life, y'all.

I'm in Minnesota. Got some mosquitoes up there, man. I got in, in the afternoon and we're sitting in his backyard and anyway, the mosquitoes up Minnesota are crazy. I figured they were worse down south, but maybe that's not true. I think my, my system's used to them down here but whatever they had in Minneapolis, I, I didn't like that. The mosquitoes got me, man. I was like, let's go inside Brian. So anyway, uh the next day, um, I'm driving back, I was in Illinois and I had II, I saw a movie in my mind of a vision.

I, I don't know how to explain it. I just, it was like, I was at a movie theater and I watched all these people in different trucks and different shops and different state cities and they're all men and they were listening to me through their CD player and, and I could, I was like behind the truck watching in and I could see him listening to me in their truck or in their, at their shop on their boom box and stuff like that. And, and when that ended, the Lord spoke to me and he said, if you build it, they will listen.

And I was by the cornfields like the movie, The Field of Dreams. And I, it was just a, it was just a interesting little scenario. And then I knew if I build a podcast, people will listen. And so I got back to Atlanta and my buddy Naylor was in town for uh he was interviewing me on youtube just to, to interview me about my law business. So I told him about this, I was like, hey, this is what happened to me. I saw this vision. I heard this voice.

What do you think? And he said, I think you should start a podcast. I was like, I don't think so. Naylor, I was like, I'm busy, you know, running my business. I just my life, like, I don't even have time to work out. I, I don't have time to add anything to my life. And, and he's like, no, I, I really think you need to start the podcast, Paul and he's like, go for it. And I was like, well, what we were at Waffle House, I was like, well, what should I name it?

He's like, green industry podcast is simple. Like, that's what we do, the green industry. And I was like, all right. So me and him recorded the first episode, this was uh 2018 and I was like, I'm gonna make a commitment to make 100 episodes. Nobody was podcasting back then. Like Joe Rogan wasn't even popular yet. Maybe he was. But no, nobody was talking about podcasting in 2018. It wasn't a thing yet. I was like, I'll make 803 episodes before I evaluate if it's worth it or not. And I had every intention of running my business another 2030 years and selling it.

So I, I didn't even calculate what was about to happen a few years down the road, but I make 100 episodes and my podcast is in the top 100 of all business entrepreneurship, like one day in the charts, it was Dave Ramsey's podcast, my podcast, Robert Kiyosaki in that order. Screenshot. And I sent it to my producer, I was like, dude, my name's sandwiched in between Dave Ramsey and Robert Kiyosaki and I, you know, my podcast for a long time there, 22, 2500 2500 we were cracking top 210 on some days because it is crazy.

And then sponsors started calling me and like, hey, we'd like to sponsor your podcast and, and, and so the podcast really started growing and, and I was talking to my buddy one day, like how many customers you got in your law business? It's like about 28020. And uh he is like, how many, you know, downloads are you get in a month? You know, and I'm like 220,203 Yeah, there was like 220 and 21,25. He's like, bro, he's like, you, you should, like, give your time to these people who are tuning in to listen to you.

Like, rather than giving them your leftovers, give them your best and, and give your lawn care business. Like, you know, not the leftovers but, like, minimize that for a while and, like, focus on this. This is crazy. And I was like, doing it nonchalant. And so in 2020 I really shifted and I put the most of my energy on the podcast and, and, and I started, um, downsizing the business and then I continued that trend in 2021 2022. And now I, I fully just do the podcast and, and serving, um, my audience, uh, full time.

And so that was never like a plan or like an intention. It just, it just kind of the way life has kind of treated me. It's like, ok, this is what I'm called to do. This is the people I'm called to serve and it shifted from, you know, Mrs Smith's front and back yard to now Tony and Greg and Jorge and all these people that listen to me all across the world wanting to know how much should I charge Paul? Like, how do I raise my prices?

Like, what should I like? I'm so now I'm, I'm like their coach if you will. And, uh, it's been, it's been a wild ride and, and a lot of fun. That is so cool, man. I appreciate you sharing uh a lot of similarities except you're more successful than me. But uh like, like I, people are like, man, I want to do what you did. I'm like, what did I do? And like, well, you sold your business and then now you're teaching others and podcasts and all this stuff.

I'm like, dude, I'm not that smart. I didn't figure I wasn't like, I'll sell my, I'll start a business and then I'll sell it and then I'll teach, I'm like, no, like every day I'm figuring this out. Like I, you who, who would have thought that I'd be hosting a podcast and have Paul Jamison as a guest. Like I didn't plan all this. I, yeah, I didn't plan all this either, but it's, it's a wild fun ride and I'm, I'm loving every, every minute of it. That's awesome.

So you meet, uh I mean, you meet a ton of business owners, uh different shows, events and stuff that you do. Uh What, what are some of the common mistakes you see people making in their businesses? I see a lot of mistakes. I think marketing money. Uh you flush down the toilet. A lot of people don't, don't market the right way to, to get their ideal customer. A lot of companies don't even know what their ideal customer is like. You know, who, who's your who's your ideal customer, you know, like, um, anyone, anyone who will give me money, like, ok. Yeah.

So I, I think identifying your customer more marketing to that customer, um, is a big mistake that that's being made. Probably the most common things that we talk about in our circle in the lawn care industry is the labor force. It's very difficult to get somebody to, to work in the heat or to my friends up north, you know, work in the cooler months in the fall and spring and in the, you know, working outside in the elements when they could go get a, a wage of the same amount working inside at Costco or Target or a warehouse or wherever.

So we face, I don't want to call it a mistake but, but hiring, you know, finding a good employee, right? Retaining that good employee. That is a pain point that if you have the answer to Ryan, like you, you'll be a Gaji Lionaire in the law business because it's just like, that's most of my D MS like, how do I find good help? And I was like, well, when you do let me know like it's just uh there's a few companies I've interviewed the North Point Outdoors in um in uh New Hampshire, Derry, New Hampshire.

I actually went there. They have the best customer or pardon me, employee retention that I've seen uh Dave Fairburn there, man. They, they, they do a phenomenal job, um, with that. But they're, they're a rare exception. Um, and I would say most guys that we talk and hang out with at the trade shows and we're having dinner, they're, they're griping and complaining. I just, I have to dial back, you know, from marketing because I don't have enough people to do the work if I got all the work and, and I don't, you know, that's a huge problem that we face in, in, in, in working outside, in the lawn care business.

It's the same for landscape lighting. Uh, I guess let's talk about that for a second. What, what are some of the things that you, you noticed that company that you said is kind of the, the gold standard. What are they doing? They're incredible. They, they have over a 90% employee retention. So first of all, when you get to their property, it, it's just a beautiful place. Like I didn't want to leave. The, the buildings are beautiful. You the, you, they have a like a humongous office building. Um It's just beau aesthetically, just stunningly beautiful and then their, their shop is just gigantic and everything is world class.

Their, their uniforms are, are looking sharp, everything is just ultra organized, you know, they have all their fuel there. Um The team members are just uh very sharp people and so they keep track like, um, so and so has been there five years, I think if you get there 10 years, they give you a company truck. And so out in the parking lot, they, they have all the company trucks that were given to the employees. And so after someone's like, working there, seven years are like, well, I don't want to quit three more years, I get a brand new truck, like brand new and brand new.

Like, you know, and I interviewed a few of the people that got the truck and they're like, yeah, like I was like, it's brand new, like brand new when I got it, you know, I had seven miles on it, like from the dealership to, you know, they've Dave's shop and, um, so, so they, they incentivize the guys with literally brand new trucks. It's not like you can only drive it at work. No, it's like your truck. Like you get a brand new truck when you're there a certain amount of time cleanliness organization.

I mean, everything there is just, I've never seen anything like it, it, it, you guys can Google them. They're called North Point Outdoors Dairy, New Hampshire. They do probably about 1820 million a year. Um, and Dave Fairburn. I, I mean, the culture he's got, there is absolutely something I've never seen before. Um, it's, it's, it's very impressive and e everyone that works there, even as like his office staff and everything, I mean, they're just, they're very delightful, professional people and, uh, they're, they're great. Yeah. Very cool. Well, I think, you know, I, I was not an expert at this.

I mean, II, I don't, I, I, again, I have like imposter syndrome when I'm like, coaching others. I'm like, who am I? I'm just some guy that ran a business, but I did learn throughout that process. I did a lot of things. Right. That other people, it was easy for me. It's hard for them. Right. And, uh, I look back, I'm like, were we amazing at recruiting? Were we amazing at branding, training, culture, all this stuff? No, but there was a lot that we did, right. And, uh I've learned more, I would say these last few years being outside of the business, um, which I, which I don't know if you've experienced that.

It's like, I've, I've learned more as a, as a educator than I have as a, as a learner, I guess if you will, you know, and, uh, the common trends I see are that like if you don't have this branded business where you have like nice trucks, a nice office and it doesn't have to be the biggest warehouse in town because you're not gonna compete with North Point Outdoors. Like, yeah, they're, they're amazing, but not everyone wants that big of a company. They like the smaller one, you can have an amazing culture.

One of our coaches, uh is, uh Dan Plata. He, he, he's one of our coaches in our, in our coaching program. And he, he's like the, you know, the bookkeeping guy, he's the one that taught me this about recruiting is like, how much are you willing to spend on a team member? And, you know, I'm willing to, I'm willing to spend X amount of dollars to acquire a customer and I'm gonna spend 13 grand on, on marketing this year. Right. Well, how much am I spending on team members?

They're, they're your internal client, right? And the lifetime value of a team member is way more than a lifetime value of a client, especially if you're talking lawn care. I mean, what's the lifetime value of a client? It's, it's not that much right? Compared to a lifetime value of a team member is, is way higher. So I think that the, the reason people struggle is because they're not focused on it. They're, they're not investing in it. They're not spending money on those nice uniforms. They're not spending money on a nice office, uh, spending time on building culture.

And I think that's, that's the difference. I mean, you see it with the companies that are succeeding. Yeah. And they have all kind of milestones and celebrations. Like if you've been there two years, if you've been there, five years, if you've been there 10 years, you get your truck and I, I might have the truck wrong. I forget how many years the truck is. But so many people that I met there's like, yeah, I've been here for five years. Yeah, I've been there for 10 years. And so when you get on boarded, like, you have a vision, they, they just drill it to you, you have a future here.

You have a future here. Like, here's what you get after this many years, after this many years. And there's other companies outside of our industry, I think of UPS. They do such a phenomenal job. I know several people, um, at both fedex and up. Si, just live in Atlanta where UPS is headquartered. But there's a lot of people, they work their whole career at UPS or they work their whole career at fedex and, and I've heard positive things about both of those who have now kind of on the retirement end of, of those companies.

And so it works in other industries and, and North Point Outdoors really has that dialed in from like day one. They're not talking about, like, well, here's how you hold the string trimmer. They're talking about, like, after 10 years, here's what you can expect. And then, you know, when, when company down the road offers you $2 more per hour. But you think, no, you know, I'm gonna get a truck. I got, I like my job. Like, I, it, it's really impressive. Yeah, it's a career path. It's, it's like, oh, you didn't just get a job, you just, you're right here.

You're at the very beginning of your new career path. Yeah. And they have a waiting list of because there are people that work there, tell their buddies and they're like, well, I want a job there and then they literally like, yeah, we're not hiring right now. We got a waiting list and then when they go to hire, they just go down the waiting list. So, like, it's a supply and demand thing. Um, it's very impressive. Oh, that's killer. That's the dream right there. Yeah. If you ever want a good podcast interview, Dave Fairburn, North Point Outdoors, man, he will blow your mind.

I, I loved chatting with him. Love it. Yeah, I'll check him out. Yeah, I think back to like, uh, my recruiting and training, you know, it was like, all right, get in the truck. Let's go. Day one training starts. Now we have an install or we have a sales call or whatever it is. Uh, and then you wonder why it's like, oh, why can't I keep people? It's like, well, what are you doing to keep people? Nothing. Right. And then the other thing he does is he teaches them the Dave Ramsey plan.

They, they have, forget the name of it, but they teach you how to manage money. So, it's like, here's how to get out of debt, here's how to save and they'll teach you about the S and P 500 like how to become wealthy and they'll share testimonies. Of people on their team that are millionaires, you know, from being a lawn care worker and you're now a millionaire. Well, here's how we did it. We saved our money, you know, and, and put in sp 500 like, they'll literally show you here's a path, not only that you can work here, but we're gonna show you a path of how you can become a millionaire if you work at North Point Outdoors.

And I don't know if too many other companies that are, you know, taking the time to teach you financial literacy and, and, and giving you the, the plan of how to become a millionaire. Yeah, that's killer. Well, not to like, go straight back to pricing but honestly, if, if you're not charging enough, if your pricing is not on point, you can't afford to teach people the Dave Ramsey plan and to ha you, you can't afford to like, take the time to build these people up and to help them.

So that's why pricing is so important is you gotta make sure you have enough profit to be able to implement these programs because a lot of people are like, yeah, that sounds fine and dandy. But how am I gonna be able to afford to do that? And it's like, exactly, you're not. So may maybe you could share just a couple of like, profit tips, like obviously raising your price. Is there, is there anything else that can help people increase their profit in their business. Yeah. All the little things in, in regards to efficiency in, in the maintenance world of lawn care.

Just making sure your route you're not backtracking or anything that, uh, your route is airtight, um, that your equipment, you know, it's better to fuel up in the evening because in the morning you, last thing you wanna do is go waste time at the gas station. It's a money pit here in Atlanta. I just drive by a quick trip and race track and our, our gas stations here in the morning and see all, you know, everyone just getting their coffee and donuts and cigarettes and mountain Dews and wasting time.

So, fuel up in the evening when everyone's tired and they can't wait to get home that way when you start every morning. You know, everything's fueled up. You're ready to go sharpen your blades in the afternoon. So the next morning you're ready to go and, and really profitability once your price is, you know, above market average or at market average, it's just all the little things that you can do to become as efficient as possible, that's all gonna, um, impact the bottom line for sure. Yeah. Very cool.

You know, it's crazy. There's all these little tweaks, you know, inefficiencies that you can find in any business, uh, even if they've already tweaked one thing. Like, usually you can find it again and, and re tweak it and those, those things add up. I mean, big time, these small little, that's, that's the definition of leverage, right? Is like one small movement here is huge outcome over here. So, yeah, and again, like you just gotta find time to be able to do that. And, uh, most people are too busy working in their business.

They got schedule time every Thursday at three o'clock or every, you know, Wednesday at 10 o'clock, whatever time works for them, they gotta figure out a time to like schedule time to work on their business. So I guess as we wrap up here, um, anything like anything come to mind, anything you wish you would have known earlier when you were starting your business. I know there's probably a lot, but any one thing come to mind, you wish you would have known earlier. Yeah, I, I wish I would have learned how to read financial reports.

So now I'm obsessed with the profit and loss statement, the statement of cash flows, the balance sheet. I meet with my bookkeeper once a month and we'll go over each of those three financial statements. But when I started out, I knew more about lebron James stat sheet and like I knew more about, you know, I could have told you who's in the A in NFL. Like I could have told you who's in the AFC north versus NFC north. I'm like, I, I knew all this stuff in my brain about sports.

I should have stopped all that back then and like threw my television into the trash until I was more successful. But what I would tell my younger self is learn to read your profit and loss statement and, and get obsessed with that, like, learn your numbers, learn what a balance sheet is. Learn what a statement of cash flow is. Understand these reports and, and what they say about your business. Um and, and really understand my numbers better. So now financially, there's a peace of mind when I meet with my bookkeeper every uh week or pardon me, every month and then I meet with my tax preparer and financial advisor every quarter.

And it's like I feel like I'm going into those meetings, like I can anticipate what they're gonna say and like I, I understand my numbers like I know what's going on, good, bad or ugly. I can, I can determine how things are going financially. So as fast as you can become a business owner and truly know your numbers. Um starting with the profit and loss statement and having all your organization and your, your finances. So having all your business income and business expenses coming out of your business accounts.

Um I use Mike mccall's Profit first plan, but having all of that in order, um is something that the young Paul I was very disorganized financially and I didn't pay attention to all these reports or even know, like how to read them. If I was looking at him, it was just a bunch of numbers for me. But now it's like I know exactly what I'm looking for and it's, it's a game changer and so know your numbers. And why is that so important? Why is that the thing that you tell your younger self?

There's a principle, the 8020 year old, the pert of principle. And once you know your numbers, then you're gonna quickly realize 20% of your customers are, are creating 80% of your revenue. And so once you figure that out, it's like, ok, how do we get more of those 20 like who are these customers? Like who, how do we get more of them? And how do we double down on what's working here and, and get rid of what's not working here? So it really helps you simplify when, when you're analyzing all your numbers, you're like, hey, here, we're making a lot of money doing this.

Let's do more of that. Let's do less of that. So awesome. Yeah, that's killer. Very cool man. Well, I know you got your uh new book that just came out. Uh How can people, what's the name of it? And how do people get a copy of it? Yes, sir. How to build a thriving lawn care business. Uh It's available on Amazon. Uh You can just type in uh Paul Jamison books or how to build a thriving lawn care business and, uh you can get it on Amazon.

So it's su super exciting and it's just a bunch of smart strategies to maximize profits. So that's what the book's all about. I love it. That's cool. And that's your third book. Yeah, it's 1/5 book. II, I wrote Cut That Grass And Make That Cash was my first book. And then I listened to Dan Kennedy. Uh, he's a marketing and sales guy that I just love because I write a book every single year. I was like, dang, this is my hero, Dan Kennedy. And he's, I was like, Dan Kennedy can write a book every year.

I'm gonna write a book every single year. So, so for the last five years or so, I've wrote a book every year and, uh, this, this is the fifth one, how to build a thriving lawn care business. So I'm exhausted now. I don't know. I, I don't know how he does it because I'm like, every book I'm, this is the last one I'm never doing. Like, I hated English class. I hate, you know, I hated writing books. Was not my. If you would have told me in high school, you're gonna be an author one day I would say. Yeah. Right.

That's awesome, man. Here we are. How to build a thriving lawn care business is on Amazon. You're definitely getting comfortable being uncomfortable. That's awesome. So you've already decided you're not doing it next year, but your past self has already committed to it. So there's, there's a conundrum there. Yeah, we'll, we'll see. I, I need a, anyone who's written a book before, you know, it's a taxing uh faxing thing to do. But the final products out now and, and uh, I mean, the world to me, if you guys grab the copy of how to build a thriving lawn care business on Amazon. Awesome.

So go get your guys' copy of the book. Also. Check out his podcast, the Green Industry Podcast. As far as I know, it's available pretty much everywhere, uh everywhere I looked, I found it. So check that out. And uh Paul, thanks so much for coming on here, man. I really appreciate it. Yeah, I'd love to get you on my podcast, Ryan. Um I'll, I'll shoot your assistant an email and, and see if we can get you on the Green Industry podcast and you could teach us about lighting for profits.

I would love it, man. Let's get it set up. Cool. I'll email her. All right, everyone. You guys have an awesome week and uh again, go get a copy of his new book, his fifth book, fifth of his sixth books, his sixth one's coming out next year. All right, everyone keep moving forward. We'll see you next week.