Lighting for Profits - Episode 179

This week on the show we welcome, Peter O’Flinn, founder of Light Up Naples Holiday & Outdoor Lighting, he has been creating festive home displays since 2018, with loyal clients returning year after year. He is also the President and Publisher of Spotlight News Magazine, a community publication he established in 2010. Peter and his wife, Katie, met as ski instructors in Vail, CO, and now reside in Bonita Springs, Florida, with their two daughters, Molly and Emily.

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We discuss everything you need to know to start and grow a successful landscape lighting business

Welcome to Lighting for Profits. All light. All light. All Light powered by Emory Allen. Get rid of your excuses. Your number one source for all things landscape lighting.

That's where the magic can happen. You can really scale a business. We really had to show up for.

Each other from lighting design, install sales and marketing. You're a scaredy cat salesman, Kurt. We discuss everything you need to know to start and grow a successful landscape lighting business. What do you think a hippo has.

To do with your business, Ryan?

Usually it's some weird childhood thing, some bully kicked your butt.

I think the key factor here is trust.

Here is your host, Ryan Lee. Oh, light. All light. All light. Welcome, welcome, welcome to the number one landscape lighting show in Bonita Springs, Florida. It's going to be an epic show. So excited, guys. I'm Ryan Lee, your host of Lighting for Profits powered by Emory Allen. And just, really excited. We got a great show lined up. If you're looking to start or grow a landscape lighting or maybe a holiday lighting business, you're definitely in the right place today. We're here to educate, we're here to motivate, to help you dominate. So, really looking forward. Today's guest, We've got Peter O'Flynn with Light Up Naples Holiday and outdoor Lighting. and Peter, is a awesome business owner. Got a marketing background, got just having a great year in business this last year and the last few years. Really so excited to have him on. So stick around. we're gonna have him on in just a few minutes and, talk about his story and talk about, some of the things that are working for him in his market before, we have him on. I want to remind you guys, coming up next month, Light It Up Expo. This is the first of its kind. We're bringing together holiday lighting, permanent lighting, and landscape lighting. So if you're looking to bolt on any one of those to your existing business, you're definitely going to want to be in Orlando, Florida, February 28, March 1, it's Light It Up Expo. And, it's going to be epic. We've got so much support from vendors and service providers. we're starting to sell a lot of tickets now, so I want to see you there. Don't miss out. listen, guys, when you go to an experience like this, one conversation could change the trajectory of your business. And I don't say that lightly. Like there's people in that are going to be in that room that are doing millions of dollars a year and what if they Tell you that one thing that's going to give you motivation or help you make a decision, maybe you're going to say no to something that you know you should have said no to. Maybe you meet your future business partner, I don't know. But we're going to have breakouts, we're going to have vendors, we're going to, we're going to have lunches included, networking speakers, all designed to help you streamline your business. So we're trying to help you break free from who you were and this person that you want to become. So get unstuck. Come to Light It Up Expo and I saw this quote yesterday on social media. I actually shared it on my, my page, but it said the cost of delay is drastically higher than the cost of failure. So don't miss out. Come to Light It Up Expo Orlando for February 28th and March 1st. I'll see you there. We've got our best pricing going right now, so get your tickets@lightedupexpo. com Again guys, in just a few minutes. We got Peter O'Flynn, light up Naples Holiday and Outdoor Lighting. this guy's an awesome guy. You're going to want to take notes because he's doing some special things in his business.

Landscape Lighting Secrets has some tips on how to grow your business this year

before we have him come on, I want to talk about some actual strategy and tactics. Okay? Sometimes we get on the show and I talk kind of high level, like, hey, you gotta be a better person, grow your business. Right? We kind of know those things. But I want to give you guys some tactics that you can use right now to make more money in your business this year. Okay? So now this works really for the majority of the people. and you know, there are some, some instances where maybe it won't work. But I'm telling you, when you look at like the average landscape lighting project in the US it's probably around 5k. Okay, probably around 5 grand. In Landscape Lighting Secrets, our average is around 11 grand for our clients and it might actually be a little bit higher. We don't have like scientific data because we just have people tell us what their average job is. And we don't like, fact check it, but it is pretty high. We've got some people that are doing jobs that are tens of thousands, hundreds of thousands of dollars as well. So if you're dealing with like a huge project, well, the tactic will change a little bit, but the principle will still apply.

There are three levers you need to manage to maximize profitability in your business

So there's three kind of levers that you want to manage and really, work with when you're wanting to maximize profitability in your business. And no, it's not cutting costs, okay? It's not finding cheaper labor or finding cheaper product. And when you're new, like that's what everyone tries to do. You know, they're just like, well, how do I import and how do I buy it? Find a, there was someone that posted on one of the group the other day, how do I find a non price gouging manufacturer? I'm like, what? Like they, they, they add value. Like they do other things other than just supply products. But many have tried to cut costs and many have failed. But here's the three levers, guys. Number one is you need to raise your price. You need to be charging a premium price. Number two, closing deals on the spot. And number three, getting high quality leads. If you can focus on those three things and get truly focused, like put the blinders on and only focus on those things over the next three, six, nine months, I promise you, you're going to have more profitability in your business. And so, there's a lot of noise out there. There's a lot of people telling you all, lots of different things. Just focus on these three things, eliminate the distractions and you will make more money. Okay? So, when you, when you do these things, you'll find yourself, getting more traction in your business. When you get more traction in your business, you're going to get more momentum. When you get more momentum, your bank account is going to fill up. So is it okay if I tell you just these, these one tactic, this one strategy that will help you raise your price and close more deals on the spot. So number one, it starts with this. Well, let's just go over like kind of raising your price and closing your deal and closing more deals at the same time. So first of all, it starts with belief. Now before you just stop listening because you're like, oh my gosh, here we go, another mindset, another mindset preaching, exercise for Ryan.

Listen, it does start with belief. So if you don't believe in yourself, how can others

Listen, it does start with belief. Because if you don't believe in yourself, how are you going to expect others to believe in yourself? Okay, you've got, you got all these people that are selling you. They want to think about it or they're not sure. Well, are they not sure? Do they want to think about it because they're not sold on your product or is it, they're not sold on you? Okay? And so chances are that you probably don't believe in yourself as much as you should. So number one, like what do you believe about yourself? what do you believe about your company? What do you believe about your offer? Do you really believe you're the best? what is your offer? Like, if I was to ask you, like, give me, like, one sentence like, what is your offer to the marketplace? Do you know what that is? Why should someone buy from you? If you don't know the answer to these questions, then you can't expect your clients to know the answers. Okay, why should someone pay you twice as much as your competition? these are really important questions that you need to be able to answer, like, without even a thought. Okay? So in order to help you with raise your belief, I want you to repeat after me. I don't care if you're driving in your truck or sitting at dinner with your family. Whatever it is, get uncomfortable. Say this out loud, okay? Number one, people need landscape lighting. People need landscape lighting. Number two, people need landscape lighting from me. People need landscape lighting from me. And number three, people need landscape lighting from me today. Say those things. Those three things out loud every single day. Wake up and say those things. I promise you, your belief will be changed now. It's not. That's not. We're not done. That's not the tactic. That's kind of the strategy. But the tactic is this. Number one, do you. Do you truly believe that people need landscape lighting? Because I do. Like, I truly do. And a lot of people don't. They believe. Well, you know, it's a want. I mean, if you're rich, you'll get it. But here's my thing. I believe everybody needs landscape lighting now. Some people can't afford it, okay? I'll give them that. If they only make, you know, $40,000 a year, they probably can't afford professionally designed and installed landscape lighting. But that doesn't change the fact that people need landscape lighting, okay? This is a necessity, not only from a security standpoint, safety standpoint, but mental health, okay? We are truly diagnosing. We're like doctors out there. We're helping people live a better life when we enhance their properties with lighting. So people need landscape lighting. And if you're already trying to argue with me, then you're not going to get belief and you're not going to raise your price and you're not going to close more deals on the spot. So brainwash yourself. Go to a shrink. I don't care what it is. Get brainwashed that people need landscape lighting. Secondly, people need landscape lighting from me. If you don't know why they need it from you then you are going to fail more and more. Okay, you need to write down all the different reasons why people need it from you. And it shouldn't just be that you're a family owned business because you know what, you know how many businesses are family owned? Like, I can't think of any that aren't. Like, everyone has a family. So, and someone owns that business. So every business is family owned. That one reason is not good enough. So why do they need it from you? Is it because you, you spend more time educating and working with your team members? Is it because you pay your people more than anyone? Is it because you go to conferences and you network with the best people in the industry? What are the reasons why people need landscape lighting from you? And then finally, people need landscape lighting from me today. Why do they need it from you today? Why can't they? Why can't they Think about it. What if they wait till next week? What if they wait till next month? What if they wait till next year? Does it truly matter? Because if it doesn't matter, then you're not going to close many deals and you're not going to charge that premium price. But I promise you this. If you will convince yourself of three these three things, your closing rate will go up. Now once you believe, you're already halfway there. So we're halfway done through this tactic, okay? So if you can convince yourself of those three things, you're going to see yourself, your quality of life, your quality of business, your quality of sales improve. So don't skip this part because this is 50% of the exercise. Now we just need to add on top of that a little bit more strategy, a little bit more tactic and you'll be able to charge not just what you're worth, but honestly, what your company needs to not only survive but thrive in 2025.

Tom Garber: I have clients charging higher prices than ever

So guys, I have clients charging higher prices than ever and they have a wait list of people waiting for them to come do their projects. Okay, there's like this correlation. For some reason the people that don't charge that much, they're wondering where all the work is. And the people that are charging like premium prices are booked out like crazy and have no problem closing deals. So what is the thing that they're doing that's different than the rest? Well, number one is when you ask yourself this question, let's say you, you call, you call a home, ah, service company, a new roof and a new ah, AC system, heater, whatever it is, when you call for a quote, what's the Number thing, number one thing you want to know when you call for a quote, like, what do you really want to know? Well, really, you want to know how much it costs? Like, what's the price? And so, What's up, Tom Garber? Thanks for being here. What's up, Keith? That time again, my favorite part of the day. Favorite time of the week. What's up, Bear Black in the house.

The majority of landscape lighting companies are not giving clients the price upfront

All right. Hey. So what's the number one thing you want to know? What the price is? Okay, so think about this. The majority of landscape lighting companies out there are not giving their clients the number one thing that they want to know. They want to know the cost. They want to know how much this thing is going to cost them. Right? And so when you consider that literally 95 of the companies are not doing this, if you just give the price, if you just give the price the very first visit, you're ahead of 95% of the companies out there, because you're giving the customer what they actually want. If you're going there and you're asking a bunch of questions and you're taking notes and you're like, okay, cool, I'm gonna go work up a proposal, and then I'll email it to you tomorrow. And then, you know, you're kind of lying to them because you're going to get busy tomorrow and you have an install, and it's probably gonna be the next day or the next day or the next day, and it might take a week. How is that over delivering? How is that giving the red carpet white glove experience by then? By the time that, you've emailed a proposal four days later, I've already closed eight jobs, okay? That's the advantage of doing this the right way. So think about this, guys. It's called the price marinade. And if you want to elevate your sales game, if you want to charge a premium price, the number one thing you got to do is tell the customer what they want to know, and that's how much the project costs. We all know this landscape lighting is expensive, and nothing's going to change. It's just going to get more and more expensive. So when you deliver a price to someone and you tell them, hey, it's $12,000, $20,000, $86,000, $186,000. Doesn't matter. What's the number one reaction you get? It doesn't matter if you give a $4,000 quote, actually, because those people think 4,000 is expensive. Every quote I've ever given, they have one thing in common. It's called sticker shock. And sticker shock is going to happen time and time again. It's always going to happen inside the landscape lighting industry. So why fight it? I, instead of fighting it, I embrace it. So what I like to do is I get it over with and I tell them the price upfront, hit them hard, get them the sticker shock. And then here's the key. When you come back later with your pricing, okay, let's say I tell someone, hey, you know what? This is probably going to be a $40,000 project. But when I come in with my proposal and I show them an option for 40,000 and then I show them an option for 20,000 and another option for 18,000, you know what I get? I get sticker relief, which is the opposite of sticker shock. And so I have people feeling good when it's time to, like, write the check, give me money. They actually feel good. They don't have sticker shock. And like, who's this guy? They're excited, they're grateful for me because I just saved them $20,000, right? So this is the key principle, is the price marinade. Get the price out there early, let it soak in, let it marinate, and then give them an option that costs that much. But also give them an option that costs half that so that they can go, you know what? We're not crazy. We're not spending no 40 grand. Let's just do the one that's only 20. And you'll have people say those exact words, only 20,000. Can you imagine what it would be like to close deals when they're saying, let's just do the one that's only 20,000. That's how you close deals on the spot. That's how you charge a premium price. So, that strategy, I'm telling you guys, has helped hundreds of people that I've taught. And these people are the ones that are charging premium prices. They're closing more deals than ever. They've got a wait list to get their projects installed. So want, to share that with you today.

Don't sell yourself short by using budget level products with poor performance

All right, so, let's get going. I want to share, real quick again. We got Peter O'Flynn coming on. But real quick, I want to play some music. All right, guys, you know this performance matters. This is true statement for a lot of things, including the kind of light you use. Don't sell yourself short by using budget level products. Emory Allen is at the top of their game when it comes to performance. Take their VA rating, for example, lowest in the industry. What does that mean? Well, efficiency. With a low volt ampere rating, you're able to drive more bulbs on a circuit with a given transformer rating. With lower quality bulbs and the same transformer, you're not going to be able to put as many lights on the same circuit. So make the switch today to Emory Allen. It's a great time to do it. All you have to do, guys, is email the man, Tom Gary Allen dot com. Email Tom G. At emryallen dot com. He will hook you up with that discounted contractor pricing mention that you heard about him here on Lighting for Profits and get that discounted contractor price. Don't go to their website. Keep trying to tell these guys. You know, don't. Don't disclose the pricing on the website because we're hooking you up with the best price. Just email Tom Gary.

Ryan: It's time to get our guests coming on here

All right. Okay, guys, we got an awesome show. It's time to get our guests coming on here. I gotta find the right music, gotta find the right buttons. What do you guys say? You guys ready? Have, Peter on. Peter's a stud. Let's get the music going so we can have him on. all right. Welcome to the show, Mr. Peter O'Flynn. How are you, buddy?

I'm doing great. Thank you for having me, Ryan.

Dude, I'm excited for our conversation. you know, I. I've. I think I've disclosed this a couple of times before on here, but I know a lot of people think that, you know, I'm doing this show for everybody else, but secretly I'm doing this for me. Like, I have a blast. Like, I love doing this show. I get to hang out with people like, you pick your brain, see what's working, see what things struggle with, and I probably take more notes on my own show, so I'm excited to, spend this time with you. Thanks for taking time out of your business life and your personal life to be here.

Oh, thanks for having me. I mean, you've gotten some very interesting people on your show over the years that I was. I've mentioned to you before. I've learned a lot from. From the people you bring on here, from, from your advice, your conversations with them. So there's a lot of. A lot of great stuff on your show.

Well, you know, I always have people send me their bios, and I used to read them all, and then the last couple years, I don't read them. I mean, I don't read. I read them, but I don't read them on. On air. But is it okay if I read your bio?

You can read. Yeah, go for it.

I really like it. I mean, you probably don't remember writing it, but I'm going to read. It's a great introduction to kind of tell people who you are. So it says Peter O'Flynn's first client asked him to decorate her home for Christmas in December of 2018. His team at Light up, Naples Holiday and Outdoor Lighting just decorated that same home for the seventh year in a row this season. Peter is also the president and publisher of the Spotlight News magazine, a local community news magazine that founded. In 2010. Peter met his wife and business partner Katie while teaching skiing together in Vail, Colorado. They live in Bonita Springs, Florida, with their two daughters, Molly and Emily. So that's awesome, man. I didn't know some of that stuff about you. So, you guys met while teaching, skiing in Val. That's rad.

Yeah. Feels like a long time ago. I was. I was going to school in the University of Denver. Like a third of the way through that I figured out that I could go to school in the summertime and take the winter off and go skiing. So that's what I was doing. That's where we. Where we met. And, and now here we are, whole different other, side of the country, different place.

But, yeah, yeah, from, from, Colorado to Florida. Well, I feel like there's more people in, in Florida that ski than Colorado because, like, when you live, like, next to the mountains, you never go. But a lot of people come from out of town, so maybe there's something to do that.

Oh, guys like the people who live here that never go to the beach.

yeah, exactly. Well, I love that. The very opening line, because you did that first client's home in 2018. You're still doing it here, you know, seven, eight years later, whatever it is.

for the eighth year, like, three days ago.

So that's okay. Well, there's another thing. So you've already sold 20, 25 projects. That's epic. We're just, you know, two weeks into the year here.

What do you do to make sure you keep your clients around

Let's talk about first. How do. What do you do to make sure you keep those clients around? Because I think most people underestimate the value of relationships and takes a lot of work to get a client. And why not just keep them happy? And why not keep them. And a lot of people will keep a client maybe for a year or two, but then they're just focused on marketing. And the next client, it's like having this bucket with holes in it. They keep filling it with water and it's all seeping out the bottom. Obviously, you've done a good job of maintaining that. What are some of your tips there?

Well, thank you. I mean, the easiest way to grow is to keep the people that already like you liking you and happy, and then be able to bring new folks in as well to grow. On top of that. I look toward, I try to look toward challenges as opportunities, service failures and response to those quickly as a way to show that you're on top of it and that you care. There are things that happen in large part with our holiday displays that are beyond our control. we have landscapers working every day that cut wires nearly every day. rodents biting wires, things getting damaged. We're out there. We have a 24 hour service guarantee. We're out there in a matter of hours. For the most part, that's one thing.

Speed is important. Um, from the basics of answering the phone

Ah, you touched in your intro on speed, and I know you're talking more on the sales cycle, but speed is important. Everything. and from the basics of answering the phone, being available, responding to your clients in a timely manner as quick as possible in whichever way it is that they want to communicate. We have clients that only want to text us. We have clients that contact us with relatively urgent matters by email. it's our job to stay focused on those emails. Whatever way that they're getting in touch with us, we're responding promptly. the risk of sounding like oversimplified, I mean, but, but it, it is to me. It's, it's that simple. we care. We're showing that we care. We want our stuff to be working great all the time. And I think that's a big piece as to why people continually come, come back to us.

Yeah, no, thanks for sharing. I know you think it's simple, but there's, I mean, the majority of businesses are not doing the simple, basic things. Like the foundation is so important. Like before you even get to like, you know, more advanced sales methods, marketing, whatever it is, like if you don't have the fundamentals right, you're just getting more water into that bucket that's gonna lose out at the bottom. So I know you said it's basic, but to most people it's not. So I'm hoping people are gonna like, replay that last 60 seconds.

Yeah, it's just, you know, you can always do things more efficiently and faster. But, you know, when you really care. And you take pride in this stuff. You want it looking its best all the time. I get more frustrated when someone won't let us know about an issue because I'm like, well, there might have been 10,000 people that drove by that day, things like that. And we preemptively check our main public commercial display stuff that we can drive by. But a lot of stuff is behind gates and communities where we can't do preemptive checks. So getting ahead of that, it goes a long way. It goes a long way for sure. And, even getting ahead of storms, this is something that I learned from, one of our mutual friends, Chris Appelstadt, and he had a post online. This was like, I don't know, five years ago at this point, maybe four years ago, they had a big storm, coming in where he is in Ohio. He reached out to his clients, letting them know that this was coming, letting them know that we'd be available, we'd be fixing. We're, we're putting you on our schedule. We have technicians available. And I saw that, I was like, man, I'm going to use this one day. And then later that season, we had an extended cold front that comes. That came in where it was blowing, you know, over 30 for three to four days. we knew we were going to have issues. Lights, that are up in palm fronds. Palm fronds fall, they're hanging. The only thing attaching them to the tree are the lights, stuff like that. and we asked all of our customers, please let us know what damage you see. As soon as it's safe in us to get, get back out there in the lift or up on ladders, we're going to be there. this is, this is a great suggestion on Chris's part because, like, number one, it's great customer service. Your clients appreciate this. Most people don't have any issues, but they know that you're there and they know that you care. and then for the things that are damaged and do need our attention, well, now that's easier for us. So now those calls aren't coming in over the course of three to five days. now I can stack these up and go send two guys out or one guy, depending on what the level of complexity is, and they can hit them one after the next. one of these fronts, one year came in like four days before Christmas. So, you know, our customers want everything looking great. We want it looking great. That approach enables you to get it fixed quicker. and keep everybody happy. Everyone really wins with that approach.

I love that. I mean, I guarantee most businesses, if a storm's coming, they're definitely not saying anything to their clients. And then even after the storm, they're not like, sending a proactive, like, hey, we're aware that this happened. Just so you know, here's what we're going to do, or whatever. A lot of them are just waiting for the call and then they're wondering later on, like, man, how do you guys do this? How are you so successful? Peter, you just seem like a normal guy. Like, what's going on? It's like, no, you're, you're doing these things. And the fact that you mentioned that this, this was like a post from him like four years ago. Like, who does that? Like, who takes notes on people's posts and podcasts? Like, most people don't implement that. How, what is going on in your mind?

There are, there are smarter people that have done most of what I'm doing and they did it before me, you know, and I'm constantly looking for ways to be more efficient, do things safer, faster. there's things that can make our guys on our team happy, that makes our clients happy as well. There's just, there's always a better way. There's always something a little more of an efficient way, especially in our holiday business where time is so important. moving efficiently means, you can do more projects with, with the same group of qualified guys. like I, I've told you this before where like, I learn a lot from random people that I reach out to and meet, like on Facebook. I mean, you've growing your business. We, we met originally, you know, in this capacity. You meet a lot.

My wife thinks it's weird I meet guys online, but. Hey, what's up?

Hey, it worked. You know, I, I've told you, you know, I, I will. I've sent, I've sent messages to people that have been on the show right after the show, asking, them follow up questions, people I've never spoken with before, like direct messages through Facebook messenger, tell them how much I learned from a few quick things and stuff that I can implement right away. It may be a quick, it may be a strategy on how to get people under contract earlier in the year. It may be something to do with how they train their guys, how they recruit. There's been countless things like this where, I just like to ask, I ask questions. I've called in the same way you can cold call a business, to sell them whatever product or service you have. You can cold call other businesses to compliment them and how they do things. And, and. And a lot of people like to help. They. They do. They. They do. They want to help, if they can help. And, that. That's really how I've looked at it, for sure.

There's a correlation between my most successful clients and being vulnerable

That's so good, dude. I, I just appreciate you sharing because I'm just telling you now, like, the person I am today is completely different than who I was 10 years ago, five years ago, even a few years ago. Like, I'm constantly leveling up. And in the past, I didn't have that perspective. Like, I don't know if it was fear, or ego. Like, why, like, why wouldn't I go ask the questions? Like, I don't know the answer? So it's either fear or ego. One of those. Probably both of them a lot of times. But, there's no doubt there's a correlation between my most successful clients. The ones that are killing it are also the ones that are most vulnerable and willing to go ask questions and willing to reach out to people and say, hey, I love what you said on that podcast. can you tell me a little bit more? Or. I mean, like you said, people want to help. Like, you're on this show. Like, you. We're not paying you to be. Like, you have no reason to be here other than to help people. Right. And it's. There's something about it. Like you're reaching back into your past and you're solving. Like, man, this person of me five years ago is out there somewhere. I want to help them. So it's, I'm hoping that people are taking your advice right now.

Yeah, there's, There, there's a lot of smart people in, in your whole world, in this program and your show that people, can learn a lot from. So.

How did you get started in holiday lighting? Nick: It started from something

So I want to ask you, how did you get started? in holiday lighting.

Sure. So this is all. This all comes back to my wife, Katie, who, you know, you mentioned earlier. She's my business partner. We do, her main focus is on the sales side of things. I'm on operations. If I want to over oversimplify that. basically she was that. That project that you mentioned that started in December, so that you know that as we all know, that's very late in the holiday world. It's almost like everything's done at that point. she was out to dinner with a few of her friends. one of them had just built a new house. They were all talking about who they knew in town that could do their holiday decorating. And Katie, you know, serious but half joking, was like, oh, my husband would love to do that. You know, like, because I always love decorating. It's just one of those things. It really started from something. It was that simple. from her, being out with her friends. she comes home, tells me about this, by some stroke of luck or whatever you want to call it. Like, I happen to be, like, researching this type of business. Like, and we hadn't spoken about this. This really. So I call up, her friend Kim. the next. the next morning, I was like, you know, is this is something you're interested in? I would love to do this for you. and it started from that. It started with one project, and, you know, the. She invited us back the next year. The next year. I think we did 10 projects after that next year. That was when I was like, okay, this is a concept that we can. We can push. We can see what this can turn into. that's when I started advertising for it. I was afraid to advertise this. you mentioned my marketing and advertising background. I also publish a community news magazine. I was afraid to open up the floodgates for this when we didn't have all our ducks in a row and we didn't have our systems in place. And I wanted to make sure that we knew what we were doing before we said we knew what we were doing. now we know what we're doing. what year?

So 2018, you didn't know what you were doing. 2019, you knew a little bit more. When did you decide, okay, I think we know what we're doing?

It was in 2020, was when I started pushing everything. So that was the crazy year. That was when everything went nuts in the world. that also shifted a lot of people's budgets from travel into Christmas, and that made for a very extended season. people couldn't travel. They wanted to. They couldn't take their kids, in our case, with many of our clients, to whatever that special trip was. And they ended up spending that budget on decorating their homes for Christmas. and it wasn't until this December was actually the biggest December we ever had, like, on a month comparison basis since the COVID year. So even, like, in spite of all our growth year after year after year, that year was a huge, huge December. This year was unique, in the hurricane challenges, which really delayed the sales cycle. We did not deal with anything remotely close to the challenges that, Nick, who you had on the show, who's north of us up in the Tampa area, faced. we had more of those challenges in the Ian year, which was two years ago, where I had homes that were under contract that no longer were livable, you know, so this year, it was more about losing six. I think it was six days of install time. you know, it cut back new sales 40% down. October to October. And that's part of living in Florida. It's. Hurricanes are part of our busy season, and it's our job to prepare for them so that we can still hit everything on time. And, yeah, so.

October sales were down 40% compared to last October, according to Katie

So when you were down, when you were down, would you say it was down 40%?

October over. So, this October, compared to last October, sales were down 40%.

Okay. Were you able to make up any of that?

November, December, we still grew our Christmas business 30% in spite of that in the year.

That's insane.

Yeah. So, like, it's just. It just creates a lot at once, you know, and then, that put a lot of pressure as well on Katie, which, you know, she. She's great at all this, but there's only so many hours in every day. October is traditionally our biggest sales month, other than renewals. Now I'm pushing it really hard on January, where last year, January was actually our biggest month, if I'm talking Christmas wise. But, yeah, the hurricanes are tricky. I scheduled additional days, what I'd call like a gap day, to absorb stuff, going into this season in anticipation of potentially losing a week. it's just tricky. You know, no one wants to. No one wants to talk about happy, wonderful Christmas stuff. When people are suffering, you want to help your neighbors, you know, and it's.

It.

It's just what it is. in the. In, like I said, like, this was nothing remotely close to what the people north of us were dealing with. But, there was a lot that was lost still this year for us of people that were new customers that were very close, that had big proposals out that now they're living in. well, one of our customers, he was flooded with both of the hurricanes. He was right on the beach. He only, I think he had like 8 or 9ft of water in Ian two years ago. So he. The first one, you know, is like a foot. Then he got a little bit more. Now he's. Now the house is for sale, you know, so he's told us he'll be working with us when he moves inland a little bit for next season. So you, know, this is just stuff that we, we've learned that we have to deal with. and that's part of why we're doing whatever we can to work as far ahead as possible. Doing prep work in the summertime, building out Christmas trees like you see behind us. Like a lot of these trees can be built in our showroom, in the summertime and then we just roll them right into the customer's homes. We're more concerned about entryway door sizes and lift gates than we are, you know, about decorating it on site.

Well, I think that's something that differentiates you against a lot of other like just traditional holiday lighting companies is you're not just like throwing up roof lines and you know, doing some trunks of trees. You guys are doing all sorts of crazy stuff.

How much of your business is like high end residential versus commercial

How much like how much of your business is like high end residential versus commercial.

So last year, last year, how do you count last year? So the, the 2023 season, we were 20% commercial. I wanted to push more commercial. I, set a goal to shift to 70, 30. We hit that right on the nose. So now we're 30% commercial. I always thought when we started doing this that that shift would happen sooner and we would be going down that road faster, more and more commercial. As people saw what we were doing, we would do more of that. the reality is we've had to be very selective of who we choose to take on on the commercial side. On the HOA side of things. There are some decades, long operating companies in town that are very reasonably priced, I guess would be the way to put it where I'm not interested in hitting their prices. It's not what we're trying to do. We provide a higher level of service. I believe we are better. We provide a higher level of attention, better design, fresher, materials. We keep things working, we respond quickly. So it's a different thing. And a lot of these guys are just priced so aggressively, that we're not interested in every account. The accounts that we bring in on the commercial side are exclusively people who are frustrated with the service they were getting somewhere else.

Nice.

so, we have been able to provide that solution for sure. Love it. yeah, I mean that some of the. We have another really cool project that's, you know, it's not technically commercial, but it could be considered as much, which is this beautiful boat parade, decorating, that our our Guy Ryan does that. he's amazing at this. I mean his, he is so talented. He was one of my very first employees. I can't, I think he was my first or second employee when we got started. and now he's back with us full time, for now, like a year now. And he does this amazing. It's a 70 foot yacht. and it won the boat parade again for the second year in a row. Done. So it's really cool. It's got a whole grid on the side. We had it done in a Toy Story theme this year. we had like the life size characters up there, Woody and Buzz around there. Jesse was on there waving at everybody. So nobody had a chance to, to beat us in that one. So that was fun. And you can see like, I, I love this stuff. It's fun. It's, it's, it's exciting. It's, it's just, it should be fun. You know, it could definitely get stressful at times. but we really enjoy what we're doing. I've been able to, to really build a great team. like I said like that, that project with what Ryan's done on there is really, it's, it's fun for me to just basically show up and take marketing videos.

Yeah, that's awesome.

From a commercial HOA standpoint, you're looking for that upper end client

Well, talk to the guy who's like. Because I love what you said about you've really defined your ideal client and you're willing to say no to a lot of people just so you can say yes to the ones that are ready. You need some people that have been burned on. From a commercial HOA standpoint, you're looking for that upper end client that just wants the red carpet white glove treatment. it's easier with more experience, momentum and a brand. When you're new, the temptation is to just be like, dude, I'll take anything I can get. And then you justify it. You're like, well, but it's an hoa. And then you're like, yeah, I'm not going to, I'm going to probably lose money, but I'm going to get like some, I'll get some exposure in there.

The answer to that question generally depends on the person, the company

Can you talk a little bit about what, like how you transitioned through that and some of the things that you did to be able to get to where you're at now.

Sure. So I think the answer to that question generally in terms of like what the right approach is really depends on the person, the company, where you are in your stage of growth and how aggressive you want to be. There are people who are happy to lose money to acquire a customer that they're going to make money in year two, three of that contract, if they have multi year contracts. what I was, I talked over it real quick as far as our first and second year. You know, that first year, one house, second year, 10 projects. But on that, that second year with those 10 projects, I was trying, and there's an element of luck to it, but I was trying to create a diverse group of projects. I had, you know, a project with three massive oak tree wraps. I had a couple projects with, high setback roof lines, different species of palm trees, different styles of lighting. And that enabled us to really analyze what were the right projects to an extent. It's not like we had a large sample size, but learning what's the right fit for us and what we can move quickly on. And even in that early stage, that was what I was, what I was focused on it. I don't believe in doing a project to just get it to lose money the first year. You know, it's just, it's not something that, that I've decided to do. but there are people who do very well with that approach, you know. So I think that it really just depends on what your appetite is and who you're trying to, trying to go after.

Being realistic with budgets on commercial projects is important

And knowing you want to talk about getting into HOA sales is very important to understand that most of these places are required to get three numbers when they're out to go to put this out. And we've been on the benefit of that. And we've also been on the other side of that, where they love us, they know they want us, and they're saying, okay, this is basically a done deal, but I got to get a couple numbers just to fulfill the requirements and then they go with us. Anyway. Anyway, there is one account, last year, I'm just thinking of that, just contacted us again in the last few days where they were trying to get preliminary numbers last year for this year because they were already locked into a contract last year. So knowing are you already under contract? and when does that release? Is this even an option? For right now, being realistic with budgets on commercial projects is important. I don't like to talk about budgets, generally speaking, but overall, because it's like, this is what this costs, right? But on a commercial situation, there is only so much flexibility, like, the odds of an HOA that's spending $40,000 to be able to snap their fingers and decide to spend 70 80, even $50,000 the following year is unrealistic. it really is unrealistic. they're all having insurance increases, too. That's part of it. everything's going up. I. I think your prices should be going up too, with lighting, when they're used to everything else going up too. But. Absolutely, those are kind of some of the. It's a different process, going after this work, and it's a longer sales cycle. So, we shut off sales for HOA projects, and it's varied how late we will go. but I believe it was the very end of August, August 31st this year. So if they contacted us in September, sorry, we're not interested in taking on your project because it just takes a lot longer to get to. Yes. sometimes there's a committee. There's a committee member that contacts you, then you talk with them, then you meet the property manager, then they present it to the board. Then they can't present to the board for another three weeks because board meeting's coming up, and by the time you get there now you're in the heart of season. I mean, we start doing residential installations, this year is probably around, like, the 6th to the 8th of October. So, like, we. We started the second week of September this year. Every year is a little bit earlier. and the focus of those early installations are the HOA projects. We can go wrap trees, of course, we're not putting up wreaths and garland, but we can go wrap trees and get the early stuff done out of the way, and then come in with the finishing touches when we need to.

Halloween, I love it. Be willing to say no so that when you find the ones that are ready to say yes, you're. You got time for them. I like it. Yeah. Talk to me.

Why did you decide to bolt on landscape lighting to your holiday lighting business

So you got this successful holiday lighting business. Why the heck did you decide to bolt on landscape lighting?

Well, I think I told you last year. You know, I have. I had considered doing this for about three years. Like, ever since I. Ever since I saw you the first time, I was thinking about this. and it was really got to the point where, like, I just originally, I didn't want to do this. I just didn't want to. I didn't think I needed to. I didn't want to. we had turned down customers that were asking for our help with doing their landscape lighting. And it really. I guess it just got to the point where I was tired of saying no. And I had. I have a great team in place that I am trying to keep in place. And it's like you said for years, if you can help bridge that gap during our off season to keep a few key folks going, well, that makes our life a lot easier and it helps us increase our capacity on the Christmas side of things. So, that's what we did. I really wanted to keep, two key people busy all summer, and we successfully did that. so I started this with the pure intention of doing just that. I wanted to keep the best people busy. It turns out that I really like this. we're pretty good at it. I've got some real smart people in my corner. Chris, who I mentioned earlier, I took a page out of his playbook and I sent him a message. I was like, I'm not taking no for an answer. You're my mentor. That's what he told me he did with his mentor. So I was like, okay, let's do this. you know, and you, know he specifically has been critically, critically important and helpful. I mean, you're talking like he was at a birthday party, I think for some family. It may have been his mom one night. And like, he's like, but I can talk to you later. We're on the phone from like 11:30 at night to 2 in the morning going over a design. but, but that's the, that's the level of commitment and energy that I think is necessary to get something going and to learn and to really understand something. Because adding in landscape lighting was a lot. And offering this service is a lot different than learning Christmas. Because at this point, you know, our clients trust us, they love us, and we've shown them that we know what we're doing. I can't figure it out. Kind of as I go, I need to bring in the smart people that, that could help us take it to another level, faster. And that's exactly what we did. So that's why, like, we've, we've done some really cool projects already. we even installed two projects during Christmas season, which you had told me that a year ago. Absolutely no way we're going to do that. That's not happening. But, I mean, even Chris used to say that. And you know, he had, he was doing landscape laying projects all through the Christmas season this year. So we'll see what comes of this as it grows. but we've learned how to really make some places look really cool. And, yeah, we're, we're, we're excited to see what comes of this because now we're getting, you know, we're, we're doing takedown. My guys are out taking everything down and we're talking to all our customers about, well, we've been talking to our customers about landscape lighting opportunities and things we can do them as we've been on their properties throughout the Christmas season. I have one meeting scheduled on Tuesday. I tried to keep this landscape lighting stuff on, on my side for now because Katie already has five meetings scheduled next week with hoas when she gets back from Atlanta. She's going to Atlanta and America's Mart to do her interior buying trip. she's flying there tomorrow. So like this is a year round thing, you know, with, with both sides of this, of this company. Christmas is not just a few month thing. You know, the, the, the commercial. Like I was saying, this commercial sales cycle is much longer. We also are in a very seasonal area, with people that come into southwest Florida for our peak season, which is really January through April. And many of those people are on these HOA boards. So many of these decisions get me in the first quarter, into the second quarter. So it helps spread things out though. I mean it's not like it all comes in at once.

Yeah, right.

And that's a good thing for sure.

What was the hardest part of getting started in landscape lighting

So when you, when you bolted on the landscape lighting, what was some of your, what were some of the struggles, the obstacles, the things that maybe you didn't anticipate? What was the hardest part of, of getting started?

Well, I, knowing it was a little overwhelming at first when you have hundreds or thousands of options of which companies to work with and you know, this, these specs say they're the same here, versus this and they're not the same thing. I wanted to get my hands on a lot of stuff. We bought, you know, multiple demo kits, more samples on top of that. I was, I needed to learn real fat me specifically needed to learn really quickly. I'm a hands on type person. I need to understand things. So the challenge was that like this was like kind of slowing my pace down, in terms of like going back to school, going back to school, spending a lot of time reading, watching videos, but getting familiar with one thing I'd say is the products themselves. What can this lamp accomplish? What is the right tool in my toolbox in terms of this beam spread, in terms of lumen output, in terms of what is it doing when it's hitting this wall? Whether it's whether it's a stone wall, whether it's brick, whether it's painted white, whether it's an off white color, all those little things that are, are simple when you've been doing this for some time. But that's what we needed to learn. So we all of our marketing is all our own in house photos. I mean we hire photographers too, but it's all our own stuff. I'm not using any, any stuff from manufacturers or anyone. And that was something that I did consider doing when we started here. So like how, how are we going to build this? How are we going to show our portfolio? we just started offering free demos, you know, and we, we're going out doing demos and we were taking pictures and we were learning a lot from that. Every as, you know, like moving things every inch this way, slight change, it changes everything. and that got us up to speed very quickly.

Love that.

really quickly. And we've got a couple of more than a couple of big projects where I mean you look through our portfolio on our website now, you know, well, you can't tell that this is the backyard and this is the front yard and this is the north side and this is the south side of this property. And it's all one huge property. But it's just, you know, some of these projects are like five projects within a project. So now it's the same thing with our Christmas portfolio. It's all our own work. It's all stuff that we've done, it's all stuff that we know how to do. We're not putting out images that we can theoretically figure out. This is that we've done and we can do for whoever's looking at it.

That'S such good advice. I mean, whether you're a brand new company getting into it or even if you are an existing company hiring on a new technician or designer, like if they'll just go out and do demos because we teach online how to design, what fixtures to use, all that stuff. But it's kind of like if I teach you how to ride a bike and I'm trying to tell you over zoom it, it makes sense. But then you're going to start to go ride the bike and fall over. You still have to crash to know how to not crash. So that's what the demo is like. I'm telling everyone, if you go out and do 20 demos, even if you're like you've, even if you've done jobs before, go out and do demos because it'll show you exactly like what you're talking about. Like what this the same Light source is going to look like on a different surface and moving it back 3 inches or forward 3 inches or like, it just helps you learn so much faster. And then get photos, like, you get photos of that stuff. What's interesting is, like, during. During the nighttime thing, you'll see it and you'll look at a photo and go, I didn't notice that hotspot. You know, I didn't notice that at the time, but now I see I need to go and add a light here, maybe take a light. So all of that together is just great advice.

Yeah, it. It is a. It's a great way to learn. And, you know, you can go into demos looking in terms of. This is a solely a sales process. Right. But it doesn't need to be that. It can be both. You can, you can get a lot out of this. You can offer to do this for friends and family. And it real. It really is for a learning experience. And it's not about necessarily selling them a lighting system. and it worked well for us. You know, it's. And furthermore, we. Every project that we have installed, we go back in the dark to do an evening focus. And that is critically important. I can't imagine doing it any other way. those slight, Those slight changes, that final 5 to 10%, I believe, really is the difference. and it's not something that everyone's doing, whether they're doing it that way or not. This is the way that we are confident in that we know that we can get the most out of what we've installed.

Nice. I love it.

Look at it in the dark.

Yeah. No, it's so huge. I'm like, kind of cheap. I don't know if people know that I'm not as cheap as I used to be. So anytime I'd go, I would go out and do every single night set as well and focus. But I'm like, I don't like to be out here for free. So that's when I upsold. I was like, hey, what about these trees over here? Like, I was just like, I have to make this worthwhile financially. Even though, like, I already got paid good money for the project. So that was my time to shine. That was when I would upsell, get more lights over in this area. And by then, now they already trust you because they've given you money. You showed up, you did what you said, you're at your. Heck, you're back there at night. Who does that? Right? And so they're a lot more trusting their pocketbook opens up and that's when you ask for referrals too. So, yeah, there's so many, so many different ways to succeed. It's just the people that are willing to be disciplined and do it right.

Did you ever try to like throw the party for the neighbors to get everybody over there

Did you ever try to like throw the party for the neighbors to get everybody over there for the big reveal?

I never did that. No. Did you do it?

No, but I'm working on that right now because one of my big projects, he just had some trees moved, around and changed. So I know they messed some of our stuff up. So we're gonna go in there and move some stuff around. But it could be a good opportunity now that when we refresh it, just because when we finished this project, like I said, we're so seasonal. Nobody was there, like on that street. Like, they probably only had like three people of all the 20 homes on the street. So now everybody's there. So we'll see what we can turn that into.

Well, I'm excited to see it.

One thing I gotta ask you about is marketing. I could probably spend two hours talking about marketing with you, but anyone who doesn't follow you

One thing I gotta ask you about is marketing. I could probably spend two hours talking about marketing with you, but anyone who doesn't follow, Peter, go check them out. Your content is amazing. I'm sure when you do this giant reveal for the neighborhood, we're gonna see that nice video documentation. Your photos, your videos. It's just, it's just done right. It just feels like a world class company. someone that I would want to hire, you know.

Talk to us a little bit about branding, marketing and some things that have helped

So talk to us a little bit about branding, marketing and some things that have helped you out.

well, thank you for the compliment, first of all.

You're welcome, man. I, I wouldn't give it. I wouldn't tell you that if I didn't mean it.

Yeah, I, I have, I've definitely made a. We have made a conscious effort to diversify our, our mix and marketing. whereas I used to depend heavily on my magazine, we still do. We still get the highest quality leads out of there, but we have to be doing other things. And some of the stuff that you're talking about is probably largely a lot of these videos that we do. they're on YouTube, they're on Facebook, they're done and spread throughout my personal network as well as our business page. And they're done. They kind of play off each other. but it really is showing people what we're working on is essentially what it comes down to. they are real short clips, short videos showing people where we're working, what we're doing, how we're doing. It. And getting people familiar with how, with how we operate is really what it comes down to. I have made a big focus to try to try to promote the things that I believe we do very well that other people just aren't doing. And it's not that they can't, but they're not there yet. And that's why I'm so heavy on our portfolio. Whether it's photo portfolio, whether it's video portfolio. our clients, I believe, see the difference between the stuff that you can get from a supplier that you can go buy that's been syndicated around everywhere. There are a couple companies in town that have the same photos that they bought from the same guy. you know, and they, they do. These guys I'm thinking of, they do good work. They, they're good at what they do. They. Maybe they're not as good at showing people that they're as good at what they do. I think we've got the best of both where we are great at this, and we are also great at showing people that we're great at this. So both of those pieces of the puzzle are real, Are real important to us.

I agree. I mean, I know there's a lot of people that will say, well, if you have the best product or service, I mean, it will market itself. But, ah, I don't know. I don't know that. I totally agree with that because there's a lot of products and services out there that are kind of inferior, but they're just genius marketing people and they understand that positioning and how to. How to. How will it make someone feel and all this stuff. And when I watch your content, when I watch your videos, your. Your photos, I know I feel good. Like, that's, That's a good sign. Right? And I'm not necessarily in your target demographic, whatever. But, there's. There's a difference there. And there's a lot of different, different ways to differentiate yourself. I talked about it, My, my beginning presentation there. It was like, just saying that you're family owned is not gonna work. But like, if you come up and, and give me a presentation and a proposal for landscape lighting or holiday lighting, and I've already had that connection with you. Like, you're, you're like 10 steps ahead against anybody else. Because I feel like I know you already.

I mean, Katie was at a meeting with, like, I think there were. I don't know if there's three or four people. It doesn't matter. There are at least three people in this meeting. And, and they started talking to her about our dog. And like, I've featured my dog in some of these videos. And you know, it's kind of like you've said that when you, when you were starting with a lot of your marketing, you were putting these videos out like your mom's watching and like 12 other people. But it was the right 12 people. It's the right person. And I'm not talking here in the thousands of views, I'm talking hundreds of views. But I don't need thousands of views. I need that one right person to see it. And those ladies in that meeting with Katie were more comfortable with her immediately. They felt like they know what we're about. They see this video of like all the guys on the crew petting my dog. And like, I don't know, people love dogs that love dogs. So it's just one of the, one of those things, it caught my attention that, like, I think we all know that when people are checking us out to work with us, any, whatever company it is, they're reading your reviews, they do a mini background check on you before they even call you. And then you still got to pick up the phone right away. And you still gotta be responsible. You still gotta do all those right things. But they are checking all this stuff out and whether it's reviews, whether it's your videos, they're getting people to, they're getting people to know you and then they can decide if they like you or not. I like to think we put a great professional appearance out there. my wife is amazing at designing these displays. People love her. my guys make it look good. They back up everything that she says and, the whole thing clicks together. But yeah, that one little 25 second video with my little Frenchie in it, got their attention. You just never know what the one, the one little thing will be.

That's awesome, man. Well, you know, you're doing so many good things, so many great things. You're doing it right. I'm a fan. I love what you're doing. keep put, keep putting it together, man. you've got a great thing going for your business, your family, your community. You're doing it the right way. So thanks for coming on here and, and sharing your advice and your, your story with us.

Thank you for having me, Ryan. I really appreciate the opportunity.

Yeah, man.

Just put your dog in videos and you'll get rich, guys

All right.

As Chris said, Frenchie power. All right, I think that might be, Peter's real secret. Just put your dog in some videos and you'll get rich, guys.

Oh, my goodness.

All right, see everybody. Have an awesome week.