Lighting for Profits - Episode 252

What separates ordinary outdoor lighting from breathtaking nighttime design? In this episode, Greg Matthews, Founder and CEO of Luxury Illumination, shares why exceptional landscape lighting is about strategy—not simply adding more fixtures. Discover how a design-first mindset transforms luxury homes into unforgettable nighttime experiences, why sometimes less light creates a greater impact, and what it takes to raise the standard in the landscape lighting industry. Whether you're a contractor, designer, or homeowner, this conversation will change the way you think about outdoor lighting.

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Episode Transcript

Welcome to Lighting for Profits, the number one landscape lighting show

>> Greg Schultz: Lighting for Profits, the number one landscape

>> Ryan Lee: lighting show in the world.

>> Greg Schultz: Oh yeah.

>> Ryan Lee: Welcome to Lighting for Profits.

>> Greg Schultz: All Light.

>> Ryan Lee: All light. All Light.

>> Greg Schultz: Powered by EmeryAllen.

>> Ryan Lee: Here is your host, Ryan Lee.

Today is the 250th episode of the show. America's 250 years old

A lot, A lot of light.

>> Greg Schultz: Let's go guys. Super excited. We have passed the 250th mark. I think it's like 252, 251, something like that. America's 250 years old. We get to party, we get to talk business, we get to nerd out on all things lighting. Today's gonna be an awesome episode. We got Mr. Greg Matthews, the CEO, the founder of Luxury Illumination and uh, I was actually reading the bio, the chief creative officer of Luxury Illumination, which actually. I like that title. So uh, we're gonna be nerding out on all things landscape lighting and uh, today is going to be um, you know actually it was actually Greg that had this idea for um, an episode and I've had him come on do this before and I've had now a couple other people do it where we do basically like a lighting walkthrough. And um, this is cool because you guys know me, I'm always talking about business and pricing and sales and marketing, all that stuff. Um, that doesn't mean I don't care about design. It doesn't mean that I don't care about landscape lighting. Like that's the whole purpose of the show. Uh, but uh, so that's, that's why it's cool. Like we're going to walk through a project and this isn't just like any ordinary project. Uh, Greg is like the king of whale fishing. He's uh, really, really good at doing massive, massive projects and um, not so good at doing the little projects. So we're going to walk through uh, this project and talk about the challenges and what was exciting, what was difficult and uh, how, how he approached it and how even got the project in the first place and stuff like that. So excited to have him on. If you are looking to start or grow a landscape lighting business, I can't think of a better place. Like why would you be anywhere else? This is the place to be. Uh, again in just a couple minutes we're gonna have Greg Matthews, the founder of Luxury Illumination on the show.

Landscape Lighting Secrets Summit is scheduled for September 9th and 10th

Um, hey, before we have him on a couple things, number one secret, uh, summit, okay. This is ah, a once a year event that we put on and I

>> Ryan Lee: call it an event.

>> Greg Schultz: It's really an experience. Um, this is our members only event for landscape lighting Secret members. And so if you're in the community. Make sure you're in the room. September 9th and 10th here in Utah Park City. Honestly, September is a beautiful time to be in Utah. Um, but really it's a great time to be in the room. So this is our members only event. If you're on the fence, like, I don't know, should I join? What is Landscape Lighting Secrets? Uh, I heard it's a coaching program. I heard it's a cult. Like you don't know what it is. Uh, reach out, let's talk and see if it's a good fit because you will want to be at the annual members only meetup September 9th and 10th. It's going to be awesome. We've even got some new vendors that are coming this year, which is completely new. Uh, it's going to be really, really cool. So, um, and then also we did announce Light It Up Expo happening. Uh, it's not soon, so you might be like, why are you talking about it? Well, because you need to put on your calendar. Okay. March one through four, Las Vegas, uh, at the Flamingo. Go to lightitup expo .com to get your ticket. March one through four, 2027. That one is going to be epic. We've got already so many different, like, cool things planned for that one, so. Gonna be really, really cool again.

Greg Matthews attended the Christmas Expo last week and was disappointed

In just a couple minutes, we'll have Greg Matthews, the founder of Luxury Illumination on the show. Um, real quick before we have him on, I don't even have like this full, like, monologue prepared thingy, woppy, whatever. But, uh, this last week I went to the show and I got to tell you this quick story. Um, I had never been to the show. It was called the Christmas Expo. And honestly, um, I got there and it just, it wasn't what I thought. Like, have you ever, have you ever bought something and it was just kind of like underwhelming at first or attended an event, they were like, oh, that's not what I wanted or whatever. Um, I think part of it's because I'm still coming down from a high from Light It Up Expo last, you know, this last March. But honestly, I got there and it was just a smaller event than I was expecting. There was less attendees. Um, it wasn't quite what I thought. And so at first, you know, I was a little, I guess, disappointed. Right. But I decided, you know what, like, that's. That disappointment is something that I could like, sit in or I could change. Right. And I've talked about this before. Um, like, you get to control the controllables and so, um, I. I did what I do best. I put my head down and I, you know, I had.

I have three goals when I go to any type of event

I have three goals when I go to any type of event like this. Number one is to meet up with existing clients. Okay. And existing people that I know. I mean, sometimes they're members of our program, sometimes not, but just build on those existing relationships. Um, you know, sometimes we know people online and social media and you. But you don't really know them. So to, like, go eat dinner with them and talk to them about their family and their friends and what they like to do for vacations and stuff like that, you get to know people on a different level, which I always really enjoy. Um, the second reason is because I want to meet up with, you know, other vendors and, um, other people. I don't know if you want to call them influencers or not, but just other people that are trying to affect change in the outdoor lighting industry. So you see, like, what products are there, um, kind of what's buzzing, what's trending, um, and, you know, build on those relationships, see what's. What's out there so I can stay on top of the game. And then finally, reason number three, I'm there to promote myself. Like, I want to. I want to get in. In front of new streams of traffic. So if there is a new event, yeah, I want to know about. I want to go. I want to see if that, uh, audience and I connect, right? And so I'm always trying to see, like, where. Where can I get myself in front of new people? What. What new eyeballs can I get? And so I want to ask you, like, what's your plan? Like, what's your plan? Are you planning to go to new, uh, expos. Are you planning to go to trade shows? Are you planning to join networking groups? Like, who are you trying to get in front of? And what audience would you need to get in front of to get in front of them, right? So sometimes it's not who you know, it's like, who you know that knows somebody that can make that introduction. So, um, what's your plan? You know, um, and for me, that was my purpose. I got there, and again, I decided that I'm not going to be disappointed. I decided to show up. And so, um, it was kind of interesting. I had actually two presentations, and I was on a panel. And so in, um, my first presentation, like, again, I'm like, man, this is like, the smallest group of people I've ever presented to. And so, like, you can't control who shows up, you can't control who listens, you can't control, um, who makes fun of you, you can't control who thinks you're an a hole. I mean, maybe you could control that a little bit, but some people just think I am. You know what I mean? So, um, you just, you control the controllables, right? And so again, it's probably the smallest room I've ever presented to. But you know what? I decided to, like, know what? I'm showing up. I'm going to bring my A game. Because even when I present, if I presented to a room of 50 people or 100 or 300, like, I'm actually in my, the back of my mind, I'm always thinking of one person. I'm not trying to, you know, change like thousands of people's lives at once. It's just like, who, what's the one person, what's the one message, message that they need to hear? And so I decided to do the same thing. I decided, you know, I'm gonna show up, I'm gonna give the same energy, same passion as if there was 100 plus people in the room. And it was really, really cool because I, I mean, I just like went crazy, you know, that's what I do. I go to, I just delivered this, like, amazing speech. I got people involved in the discussion, everything, and was really cool because the next day, uh, and you leave and you don't know, you're like, did I help someone today? Like, I don't know, there's those fears and anxieties and stuff like that. But, um, the next day, one of the attendees came up to me and they thanked me. They're like, man, thank you, like, so much for your time and thanks for the words that you shared. And like, you really inspired me and you helped me with these things. And they said it really helped them because some of it was stuff they were just, they were thinking about. And it really helped them kind of unlock some things for them. And because of this, I'm pretty sure we're going to end up doing some business, um, at some point in the future. And again, I wasn't thinking like, okay, what can I do to convince, um, someone to like, me or anything like that? I was just trying to help. And it was cool because I literally just got rid of that negative mindset of like, ah, it's only a small room or whatever. And, um, it was really, really cool to see that, like, hey, you can only control what you control and you can still help someone today. So Whether you're presenting to a room of a hundred or just a handful of people, or you're presenting a $3,000 job, or you're presenting a $300,000 job, like, give everyone your best. Um, don't eliminate someone or don't, like, you know, have that negative energy just because it might seem like a small opportunity. Because you. You just never know. You know, show up your.

>> Ryan Lee: Your.

>> Greg Schultz: Your In. In. Your best.

Show up with your A game. And, um, you just never know who's listening

Show up with your A game. And, um, you just never know who's listening and what's going to come out of it. So that was just kind of a cool experience for me. And who, uh, knows, you know, nothing formally, officially has come out of it for me, but I feel good about it. I feel like, you know what? Like, I was supposed to be there. I was supposed to go make the sacrifice. I was supposed to, um, go do my mission of those three things. And. And it was cool, too, because I was able to meet with existing clients and go to dinner and hang out with these people that, again, we know each other, but we were able to, like, build on that relationship, got to know them a little bit differently and. And understand a little bit more insight onto, like, what drives them and what's holding them back. And I. And I think I was actually able to help some of them just in these small conversations. So, um, ultimately, I'm grateful. I was. It was really, really cool, um, to go be part of that experience. Even though, like I said at the beginning, it was like, uh, I was kind of questioning, should I be here? Um, but. But ultimately, I really am grateful that I was invited. I'm really grateful that I was able to show up and grateful for the small amount of people that gave me their time, their attention, and their energy, so. Energy? I think so.

Emory Allen makes premium LED lamps for lighting professionals who demand the best

All right, there it is. Friends. Don't let friends install crappy lamps, okay? Emory Allen makes premium LED lamps for lighting professionals who demand the best. So don't settle for less. Upgrade your designs and installations today with Emory Allen. All you need to do is email Jackson L. Jackson and the letter l jacksonlryallen. com to learn more and take advantage of their contractor pricing. Just email jackson l@emryallen .com. don't forget to mention that you heard about him here on Lighting for Profits, and he will hook you up. Email jacksonlryallen. com all right, guys, um, again, uh, grateful. Grateful for Emory Allen, too. Thank you guys so much for your support. Uh, 250 some episodes. That's crazy. That's wild.

Greg Matthews joins us to talk about lighting projects and how to approach them

All right, guys, let's get our music coming on for our guest. I hope you're ready. Welcome to the show, Mr. Greg Matthews. What's up, Greg?

>> Ryan Lee: It's good to be back home. And by that, I mean back on the podcast I've been on so many times.

>> Greg Schultz: I know. Is anyone keeping track? This is powered by Greg Matthews.

>> Ryan Lee: Not quite. Not quite. I will say. Uh, well, the project we're gonna look at today, um, is actually an Emory Allen lamp project, so.

>> Greg Schultz: Oh, that's cool. I wasn't. I wasn't planned. Or was it. Or was it, um. Well, it's always great having you on, man. Um, honestly, I. I may have told you this before, but I'm actually not sure. Um, you know, it's. It's been fun getting to know you just on a personal level, from a business standpoint, everything. But until I met you, like, literally until I met you, I didn't know. Like, I talk about, like, um, you know, like, your false beliefs and what's holding you back and, you know, like, stop playing, like, stop thinking small and all these types of things. And I continued to, like, exercise that muscle in my life, surrounding myself with people that are doing things that I haven't done. And until I met you, I didn't know that you could do certain things with lighting. Like, my biggest project was 150,000, and I thought that was pretty good, you know? And now that I've been hanging around you, I'm like. I'm telling people, like, yeah, I mean, why would you limit yourself? Like, there's people like Greg that are doing these massive projects, and so you've really helped me expand my mindset and really kind of break some of the false beliefs that I've had. So. Thanks for being an inspiration, man.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. And I actually don't like referring to projects by dollar amounts or fixture counts or whatever. I just like going through design, and that's what it ends up to be. Like, I'm not trying to rake up that bill. I look at a property, like, we're gonna look at, and if you see a, um, you know, if you say fixture, too many fixtures on this project, let me know and I'll give them a refund. But, um, when I walk that property, I'm not looking at how much money I can make or what we can upsell to the client. I'm really looking at who this client is, uh, what they're used to or what they. They should have in their lives. And I want to produce that for their clients so that I don't undersell and, you know, I give them the best quality lighting that I can possibly do with my abilities.

>> Greg Schultz: That's awesome. That's killer. So, like, when, when you approach a project and what, what we're going to do today, guys, we are going to, like, Greg's going to share his screen. We're going to actually walk through this project here in a minute. But, um, I've also got some other questions that I'm going to like, you know, filter in there.

Do you ever ask for a budget for a project

Um, but, like, it just brings me to my, like, one of my questions is, like, when you, when you're approaching a project, you go up there, you see this amazing space. Obviously your mind starts to be flooded with ideas and stuff like that. Do you ever ask for a budget or. That doesn't matter because your design is going to be what it is.

>> Ryan Lee: So I do not ask for budget. Um, if we. Obviously people have budgets, no matter who they are. You know, if you have 17 homes, maybe you're saving for your 18th home. Who knows? You have no idea what's going on, somebody's life. Um, but we do a design. If we need to reduce something, then I walk with a client. We can reduce certain areas, take an area off maybe. I hate, you know, phasing it out. I honestly do. Um, but if we have to, we can phase it out and do something properly and kind of figure out a route to take it that way so we have everything. You'll see a design that we put together and how it's laid out. The placement plan, the wiring diagram, the transformers. We, uh, usually do the zoning layout as well. Um, we'll present it with a portfolio to actually, you know, represent what we're trying to do. And then, um, we'll work with a client. If it ends up being more than what they want to spend at the moment, then we kind of figure out what the next step is. Um, but, yeah, what is your budget is not going to be what I want to put on this property. And it's not that I'm trying to oversell, like I said, but people are not used to this. So this particular home we're going to look at had existing light lighting done by some fancy smanchy, you know, New York City designer and all that. Um, and that's what we ripped out. And some other fun things to talk about this project is this was the third home I did for this specific client. So we'd already lit two of their other homes in two other states. So they owned all these homes at the same time. Um, and this One ended up being my favorite, but I kind of had to get to this. So at this point, it turned into like, you know, I totally trust you. And, um, you kind of do what you want to do. And all three homes have kind of a different feel, different style, different design, based on where they're at and kind of like the whole property and what they're going for.

>> Greg Schultz: So you, ah, I mean, this is your third home. You earned the second one and earned the third one. How. How would. How did you get introduced to them for the first, uh, project?

>> Ryan Lee: Just a simple. This is a, uh, av. Um, referral partner that we had. He had been there, helped, uh, them with a lot of personal specialty things for the last probably 20 years. Friends with a client, um, introduced us actually here in Florida. Um, we mocked up. Actually, we did not mock up. I sold her lighting for the driveway of her house, which I believe was like 75 to $80,000. And once we did that lighting, she loved it. So then I was able to do the rest of that property and then move on to the next one and then move on to the next one. So we did all three properties, I'd say, within about a year and a half.

>> Greg Schultz: So, like, on that. That first one where you just did the driveway, you're. You obviously, I'm sure, wanted to do more than that. Is. Is there a reason you only did the driveway at first?

>> Ryan Lee: Well, that would say gain the trust. So, I mean, very particular client, I can't. They're nobody famous. They can afford anything in the world to do this for them. And a lot of these clients, when they get to this level, are not like, hey, you know, you write down on a piece of paper how many fixtures it's going to be, how much per fixture kind of thing. Like, we literally have to go through the design with them because they're that educated. You know, they dealt with designers before interior designers. We have to, you know, explain shadowing, how we're going to have hierarchy levels. It's not just throwing lights on a plan and selling it to them because they're going to. They would. They would be able to call your bluff in the end, and they wouldn't be happy.

>> Greg Schultz: So when you. When you presented the project, was it, uh, did you tell her, like, hey, we want to do your whole property, but let it, like, let us prove ourselves with the driveway first? Or what was the plan there?

>> Ryan Lee: Uh, yes. So it's kind of like just because you're, you know, that's what I basically offered to her, say, hey, let's just light the driveway. And like I said, it wasn't a mock up. It was you're gonna own this whether you like it or not kind of thing. But I was that confident where I didn't even really want to totally close the deal. I just said, hey, It's the rest of the proper.

>> Greg Schultz: Breaking up a little bit.

>> Ryan Lee: There you are.

>> Greg Schultz: All right. Sorry, We. It was cutting out a little bit. So you, you told her, let me start with the, the driveway, and then if. When you like that, then we'll do the rest.

>> Ryan Lee: Exactly. And once she loved that, it was kind of, uh, you know, we gained that trust. We still went through all the designs, through the processes, uh, but we were able to prove that we were, you know, gonna produce a product that she was expecting.

>> Greg Schultz: Cool. Well, I think, you know, I've. Before I started what I'm doing now, I was never even on Facebook. So I definitely wasn't in the Facebook groups, if they even existed. But I know, um, I don't know if it's still like that, but there used to be this, like, discussion of, like, you know, do you charge for designs? And I was like, well, let's, let's talk about that.

What's the difference between a design and an estimate

Like, what's the difference between a design and an estimate? You know what I mean? Like, because if you are just going to someone's house and it's a $8,000 job, um, maybe they're not getting the design that you're about to show us. Maybe they are just needing an estimate and doing that. So I think there's a difference because, you know, some people say design, but they're not necessarily doing a design. They're just telling them it's 12 lights and it's $8,000. Clearly, um, what you do is different. And like you said, you're dealing with more sophisticated buyer who's dealt with architects and interior designers and needs to look at plans, and that's the language they're used to.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I mean, she is, um. I had to learn French words that she, you know, just to impress her, because she's into certain things. So I learned about the client, um, and design. You know, some. We always start for design. Sometimes it's not up front. Like, if I have a strong referral partner, we know we're doing the project. I'll work it through. Um, we're doing another project right now where I've been on it for three years, and we haven't put a light on the ground. We're about to in a couple months, but that one they paid the different design fees for the different areas throughout this process.

>> Greg Schultz: Nice.

>> Ryan Lee: So it really varies per project.

Another fun thing about this project is it's in a different state

>> Greg Schultz: Well, let's jump into it. Let me, um, turn this off. We'll share this screen and then you should have control over it. Yeah, that looks good.

>> Ryan Lee: Another fun thing about this project is it's in a different state. So I'm obviously down here in Florida. And this is up in Illinois, um, suburb outside of Chicago. So during the install I had my crew up there and we also worked with, uh, Mike Long's team from Light, uh, Quest. So it was great to have an on site assistant for that project, kind, um, of a home base and also somebody up there that can help, you know, do some servicing, um, throughout the year if they need something. But we actually fly our own guys up there, uh, twice a year to service a property and do maintenance on it.

>> Greg Schultz: Pause here for a minute because I know there's people that have wealthy clients that also have another property in another state that they never even get a chance at. Sometimes they don't even know they own a second, third, 19th home or whatever. Right. Is there anything that you're doing to get the opportunity to go do a design out of state?

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. Learn your design skills. Um, go to Illy, go to aolp, practice this stuff and don't be afraid, uh, be afraid to design it properly because if you just put lighting in it doesn't impact them, then why would they take you somewhere else? Um, if you can go in there and you know our motto is we change lives one night at a time. So if you can't do that, then why would they pay for your travel expenses, fly you up there, have you take out lighting, put in new lighting. So it's got to be something where, you know, you know, don't hold back. Basically design it properly and don't oversell it or undersell it.

>> Greg Schultz: Cool. And then you've done this obviously, and. Well, how many states is it up to now?

>> Ryan Lee: Sixteen, uh, states, three countries. And we just did a design for a 17th state. And I have to go to a fourth country, I think, later this year.

>> Greg Schultz: Shoot. Sorry, man. Yeah, well, how do you, how do you pick, uh, like in this case, like you said, it was Mike Long in his company. You've gone, you've done this in other states. How do you go about that relationship and deciding who you're going to use and if you're going to use them and like how much scope they're gonna do and everything else?

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, we, we always have people on site. Um, you know, we designed it. We needed to see what's going in, how it's gonna be going, how high the tree lights are, where they're aiming. You know, I can't. I'm not gonna hand over a design and come back at the end and be like, well, let's change it all and fix it. So we always have people involved. Uh, Mike's been involved in our landscape lighting Legends group with you. Um, I know him well. I trust him. He runs a great business. Um, so why not bring him on? He's his office, I think, 30 minutes away, 45 minutes away. So that's great to have. And we're about to do two, uh, jobs up the Hamptons, so I'll be using some crews up there, including Billy Coggins. Um, uh, Jake is actually going to be helping me do some tree climbing up there. So if we know people from these organizations, just like you said, networking, you never know how it's going to come back around, how you're going to make friends. Um, you know, I got a lot of people that call me or text me or message me all the time for some kind of random question, because we've dealt with a bunch of this stuff. So it's great to have great friends around the country, uh, that you can really depend on.

You don't want to just take a project on like this and

>> Greg Schultz: I guess while we're on this topic, and I know we're going to get into, like, seeing the design and the nighttime stuff, but I, um, know someone's going to be listening and, and they're. They're gonna get a lead. Like, they're gonna get a lead like this, and they're not qualified to do it. Should, um, they reach out to you?

>> Ryan Lee: Absolutely. We've done that for other lighting people, and it turns out great. Um, turns out great for the company referring it, and it turns out especially great for the client. You don't want to just take a project on like this and kind of, like, put it on a whim, you know, even if you get it installed somehow and it looks fine. Did you do it properly? Did you do your runs properly? Do you do your connections right? Is it going to start failing in a year? Um, we do all the engineering, the wiring diagrams. Um, we basically corrosion test different brands here so we know which fixtures work better. Uh, we've helped design different application, you know, different products for different manufacturers. So we've dealt with a lot of different things, um, in different areas, so absolutely love it.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, I, I see people like, getting some pretty good opportunities, and I'm like, dang, like Good job. But, like, the answer is who? Not how. Is there, like, uh, how do I do this and what lights should I use? I'm like, well, those are fine questions, but the better question is, like, who should I be hiring to help me do this?

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. And this. This is the next slide here, just showing the different types of fixtures we use on this one property. So there's not, like, three fixtures. So there's different applications for different, uh, sections. You can see our wiring diagram is here, our transformer locations. Uh, we're dealing with a lighting control system or dealing with, uh, on the architectural lighting, we're drilling into stone. That was a French gutter. Um, so it really matters to do this properly. The other benefit of us is we have the portfolio. So I have pictures of pretty much every kind of application that we've done ourselves. It's not somebody else's picture I'm using. So we're able to close those deals with the right amount of fixtures. Because I'm saying, hey, this is what we need to do to produce this. We're not trying to just add things here and there. If you want it to look like this is what we need.

>> Greg Schultz: How often you get someone at this. When you're showing them this and they're going, man, that seems like a lot of dots under that one tree.

>> Ryan Lee: I don't want it to look like Disney World. I don't want to see it from outer space. Uh, what else do I hear? Um, you know, so. Yes.

>> Greg Schultz: Where did that come from? Because everyone, Everyone says that the Disney thing, I don't want it to look like Disney. Like, where did this come from?

>> Ryan Lee: Is that, like, Disney World? Landscape lighting sucks. Um, yeah, but they have a lot of lights. I think that might be, um. I'm not sure.

>> Greg Schultz: For some reason, they associate it with Disney all the time. So what do you do when that happens?

>> Ryan Lee: Well, we pull in our design, uh, stuff. We talk about lower lumens. We talk about more control. We talk about International Landscape Lighting Institute. We talk about using, uh, shrouds. We talk about down lighting. Um, we talk about, uh, resourcefully doing it, responsibly doing it. Um, what's funny is the next picture, you'll actually see the drone picture, which matches this design layout. But this design shows all the different fixtures we're using throughout the property, where they're aimed, how they're put together. Um, and like I said, it's a lot of different things going in to make one thing happen. Um, for the whole thing to come together. When you look at the pictures, if you started taking things here, uh, out here and there, you would notice big gaps. You know, once you get it fully properly done, if you never put that in there, you may not notice it. You'd have big dark spots which actually stand out more than having a kind of a balanced lighting throughout.

>> Greg Schultz: Nice. Okay, cool.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, you can see this is kind of the drone picture, kind of matching the design before.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, that's cool.

>> Ryan Lee: So you can see how the fixtures line up to that and what they're all doing. And obviously, you know, we have dark sky, we have all this kind of stuff. With the right lumens, right output, this is not really affecting. It's, uh, not creating a sky glow at all. So by using more fixtures, again, we go back to lower wattage and lower output. So I'm not trying to light up a tree with some massive floodlight. That's really going to tick off the neighbors. You know, we want something beautiful that doesn't impede onto the neighbors, no matter how much money you have. And sometimes the more money you have, the less you want to really make enemies in your town, because that's what people are living for. You know, they go to the clubs together, they go to different events. You don't want to be the one that's, you know, upsetting everyone.

How many light fixtures was this show? 731

>> Greg Schultz: How many. How many light fixtures was this?

>> Ryan Lee: 731. I counted it right before this.

>> Greg Schultz: And the funny thing is, right before the show, I was like, but great, why not 732? And what would you tell me?

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, tell me where to put it. Because we don't oversell lights. That's why. And we don't oversell lighting. So, yeah, I, uh, would. 731 was what was needed, and 731 is what was put in.

>> Greg Schultz: Nice.

The Masters of Landscape Lighting book is amazing. It should be in your office

Awesome.

>> Ryan Lee: And then get to one of the coolest landscape lighting pictures, I think, of all time. It's pretty epic. Um, but that shot from a drone, which is one of the hardest ways to shoot landscape lighting. And then. Yeah, I know you're in this book also, but. The Masters of Landscape Lighting book. But there's actually this image is in there on page 84. So whoever doesn't have this Masters of Landscape Lighting book, it's on Amazon, but it's pretty amazing to own. We don't make any money off of it, but it's got designers from all around the world, not just the country. And if you're getting into landscape lighting, you should order this immediately and then check out all the different styles looks. It got different Areas of the country, uh, uh, different islands. It's. You should own this book. It should be in your office.

>> Greg Schultz: Great book. Masters of landscape lighting. What page is this one? On this you have a bunch of pages.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, 84.

>> Greg Schultz: Well, um, the thing I love about this photo is, you know, the, the first one that shows the design and the dots on paper and then you see like, okay, this is the. After. This is exactly like what it looked like to me. That can kind of be intimidating a little bit like as a, as a homeowner, as a, as a purchaser. But then you see this and you're like, okay, I want that. Like, how do I get that? And so that's pretty easy for you to say. Like, look, dots, lights.

>> Ryan Lee: There you go. Yeah.

>> Greg Schultz: If you want it to look like this, it just happens to take 731 fixtures. Can't do it. Can't do it with 730.

>> Ryan Lee: No, you tell me if I. Yeah, exactly. And you'll go into like the different areas, a lot of these homes when they get larger. And we also had bigger homes where they didn't have as many complicated areas and you have less lights. So you're really basing it on the complexity of the gardens and the different areas, the sitting areas, uh, your viewpoints, your focal areas. So you can have the most expensive home in the world, but if you have two trees and you really can't put that many light fixtures there.

>> Greg Schultz: You know, we had that like in, in Dallas Fort Worth, in the, in the country, we'd have projects. Nothing like this. It was more like the courtyard of this. You know, we're like. It seemed like a lot of lights at the time. And then you'd go to like, uh, like Dallas proper, really nice homes. I mean five, six, seven million dollar homes. Uh, not, not a whole lot to light. I mean there's, you know, you like the architecture and then maybe some of the trees, but there just really wasn't much vegetation. So they were almost kind of like thinking like that's it. You know, they're expecting a higher price point. It's like, yeah, I mean, we're gonna make it look awesome. And it is what it is. So. Yeah, it's not always about how much money someone has or anything like that. It's like you said earlier, it's just whatever it takes to do the property justice.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. And that's when you sell them Outdoor Audio as well, because they can at least you can add on to your um, you know, application with Outdoor Audio to kind of continue that whole experience, if you can't only do so many lights, but they're like, hey, what else can we do?

>> Greg Schultz: We still have money.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I don't want to go stare at my. My tree and hear crickets, you know? You want to hear some music while you're doing it.

>> Greg Schultz: Of course.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. Um, so here is kind of a before picture during the day. So they have this big driveway, um, and kind of these. These really thick bushes and lead you up to the home. But a lot of hardscaping and a lot of just very harshness. So nowhere to downlight from, really. Um, like normally you would. And then the island is kind of everything short. So what we did is we actually put lighting within the elevated hedge and shot through it to create these almost like real gobo patterns onto the driveway. And even during winter, when the leaves are gone, you get the cool branches onto the ground, so it's still all shrouded, even when the leaves are gone. But as you drive up, you get this great shadow pattern that leads you right up to the front door. And we kept kind of the, uh, middle island minimalistic, but just lighting the urn and a few path lights. They didn't run into any of the bushes. And then the short bushes are actually lit from the inside of them to make a soft glow

>> Greg Schultz: where. So the. The down lighting, like you said, is giving you the. The effect on the driveway. And then which ones were you saying were uplit?

>> Ryan Lee: So we have some in these.

>> Greg Schultz: Oh, there's some there too.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. Just very subtle. And then we have uplighting and urn. And then the pillars up here had never been lit. So we're down lighting there. And then we're uplighting across the whole. Um, this is actually a slate roof tile, so it's all natural stone. And on that. Let me see if the next picture has a different picture. But on that, the slate stone slightly variates because it's a natural stone. And some has, like, moss on it. Some is a little darker, lighter. So use small tunable white fixtures. So some may be 2700k, some may be 2730k, some may be 2650k. And it was dialed in to make it look cohesive and consistent to make the actual, you know, surface area that was inconsistent match better in real life.

A tornado came through during a photo shoot, changing the lighting dramatically

>> Greg Schultz: That's way cool. Yep. Instead of just doing the same thing across. Across the. The whole front there. I like that.

>> Ryan Lee: Yep. And what's funny, too. Well, I know it's funny, but, uh, so you see Here the driveway is nice and beautiful and clean. So halfway through this photo shoot, a tornado, uh, decided to come by through the property. So if you look at the next picture, it's, like, wet, and there's leaves everywhere. But we literally had trees, like, bending over halfway during the photo shoot. So that's why it's funny that it switches from beautiful and dry to a wet surface area.

>> Greg Schultz: I thought you would. You know, you see the people wetting down that, you know, maybe you got the hose out.

>> Ryan Lee: That was natural. So we knew the reflection. Yeah. We knew we were going to have a bad weather. So I'm like, all right, we're flying the drone first because that'll get blown away. And then we're shooting as fast as we can. And then, uh, we kind of had to shoot a few things a little bit short, and then I had to settle for this picture, which is fine. But, um, yeah, when I go back up for another service, I'll probably reshoot it where it's nice and clean again.

>> Greg Schultz: I like. I like the wet look. You get that. A little bit of reflection. I think it adds to it.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, it works. So. And you can see the columns here. I get a little bit of hot spotting here. In real life, you don't really see that so much. But we only had about an inch to an inch and a half of stone gutter to work with to light up these pillars, which had never been lit. So, like I say, sometimes a juice is worth a squeeze. So we actually created, like, small shrouds to eliminate that glare as much as possible. Like I said, in real life, it's not that bad, but it was still worth getting this full effect and not having these pillars just totally dark.

>> Greg Schultz: Are you not tempted to just, like, Photoshop?

>> Ryan Lee: Oh, God, come on. Don't do that. No, no, because that would be not my lighting.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, yeah.

>> Ryan Lee: Now, I'm not eliminating that. So if you see a hot spot or a glare, it's because I didn't name the light. Right. So. No, that would be easy m to Photoshop out.

>> Greg Schultz: Oh, yeah, it'd be super easy. I think most people do.

>> Ryan Lee: Uh, no comment.

>> Greg Schultz: Just saying.

>> Ryan Lee: No, I know, but then also, when I go to present to another client, you know, they're gonna think that these lights are magical and don't have any hotspots. You know what I mean? So you're always dealing with something. But, yes, like I said, in real life, it's not as bad, but people do need to know reality as well.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, I mean, that's true. Even for when I would do iPhone shots. You know, you take the picture with the iPhone, you're like, it's not as hot. But I use that as a learning tool to be like, well, let me. Let me see if I can go adjust it. Uh, because my natural eye wasn't picking that up, so maybe it could do something. And all of a sudden, you adjust it, and you realize it looks better.

>> Ryan Lee: Oh, yeah. Cameras are the biggest tattletale in lighting. So, like, even when we're doing night aimings and night walks, you get your cell phone out, look around, you can see your hotspots. You can see color differentiations. You can see where it gets too dark and too bright. Um, you can tell if you have, like, a lamp. That's bad. It dramatically shows you the differences in lighting through your cell phone camera. That's a great tool at night.

>> Greg Schultz: So you're looking at a space like this. What's. What's on your mind, what. What things are going through your mind.

>> Ryan Lee: So this. I'll show you two daytime pictures. So we'll call this a pergola. It's a beautiful wooden, handmade pergola. Um, we have a couple focal points here. We have a fountain, obviously. And what's cool is these, like, portals, I called them. They're almost like portals behind the benches that had an opening in the bushes, so you can kind of see through them. So I don't want my lighting just to be, uh, beautiful. I want it to be functional as well. So you have form and you have function, because what would be the point if you just looked at lighting? So what I'm going for is a space that you can walk into, enjoy yourself, but then still not be in the light. So now if you see this, our portals are lit in the background to relighting throughout the hedges. Um, our fountain is downlit here, but the big thing you notice is that the benches are still dark. So we're not lighting a person. Um, we're not, you know, making them feel weird. Like, you don't. Your body will sense that kind of tension if you get that hot spot in your eye, the brightness. So I think we use, like, 18 fixtures on this pergola, and I think they're mostly one and a half watts somewhere right around there. I forget the lumens, but we're going for a very subtle feel where we're lighting different applications and areas around it.

Using less light fixtures makes this a usable space

And then we have other lighting around the taller trees behind it to kind of frame the pergola as well. But this helps Lead you in right to where you need to go. But throughout the middle, this didn't need to be lit, so why would you light it? So that goes back to using less light fixtures instead of putting four wash lights in the corner and making this a not usable space.

>> Greg Schultz: Nice. Yeah, it looks amazing.

>> Ryan Lee: And that's looking back towards that way. So this would. This would be you sitting in the bench. So we're using a mixture of up and down lighting, you know, shooting down and shooting up to kind of create that balance while still leaving some of it, you know, more shaded, not totally dark.

>> Greg Schultz: Cool. I like it.

We use lower light levels as you're getting towards the home

>> Ryan Lee: All right, so here is a front driveway. So it's more of a darker neighborhood. I, uh, wouldn't say full dark sky, but it's more, uh, discreet. So we're not going to light it like a Dallas home, where they just want to be like, yeehaw. So we need to be more discreet, kind of show things. Um, I wanted to highlight the flag a little bit. Your pillars, how do you get in the house and then kind of balance out your entry into the home? So we use lower light levels as you're getting towards the home, and then as you actually get through to the trees through the gate, they kind of brighten up as you go. Uh, so we're actually downlining that flag as well. So we're not having to do an extra light, you know, for the flag. It's kind of cross lighting here to hit the driveway, but it's doing it subtly where it doesn't kind of stand out too much. But they can still represent America as they should.

Are you varying color temperatures here or. Do you tend to do that

>> Greg Schultz: Are you varying color temperatures here or.

>> Ryan Lee: No, no, not. Uh, I don't know if I did on the pillars or not. I may have on the pillars because they're a different shade.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, it's hard to tell. I mean, sometimes just the same color temperature lighting, a different application makes it look different. But, um, I don't know, do you. Do you tend to do that? Like, if you see like, um, a different color temperature plant versus a warmer color temperature wall or something like that, Will you vary the temperature?

>> Ryan Lee: Sure, absolutely. And a lot of times American flags where we want to be seen and stand out, we'll do 4000k, because you want your red, white, and blue to be red, white, and blue. Um, and you kind of want them to stand out, you'll actually. Yeah, I actually have a really good color temperature example in this. I just remembered. So we'll see that later. But yeah, that looks like good old glory there, where it's. You Know, still warm, but you can still see the flag.

>> Greg Schultz: Cool.

>> Ryan Lee: This next one, it looks like a public park, but again, this is like, one little section of the backyard. So again, going into why you need so many fixtures, um, we have, you know, walkway to come down the steps. We have a beautiful bench to sit in. Uh, the tree. You can see how dense the foliage is, too, which makes it very challenging. You know, the denser the undergrowth is and the less down lighting you can do, it makes it kind of challenging. But we ought to create this, like, nice little scene where it's just a little destination you make it to. And the bench looks like it's lit, but the lighting is actually behind it. So you're getting a little throw from it. But if you were to sit in the bench, you wouldn't be be, uh, lit in your eyes, basically.

>> Greg Schultz: How do you determine how many down lights you're going to do from a particular tree or certain area?

>> Ryan Lee: So I guess you got to figure out what you're going to light first. So we're going to hit the bench. Um, we're going to hit the flowers around it. Uh, the size of the canopy of the tree. This one probably has six to seven downlights in it. Um, and they're different, hitting different areas. The more downlights you have, again, same thing with the control, the less hot spots you have. So the old school moonlighting technique where they throw a giant metal halide or halogen up in a tree, if you look at those, you get a giant hot spot up top, and then you kind of get the effect down below. But whenever I look at those trees, the first thing I do is look at the top of the tree, and then eventually you might actually see the effect. So I try to eliminate those hot spots as much as possible.

>> Greg Schultz: And how high do you usually go?

>> Ryan Lee: Uh, serviceable. So if we get to a ladder, so usually stay 25ft or below. This one I do have a variable is also. So you'll see that coming up, too. We're ahead to bring in a tree climber.

>> Greg Schultz: So when you bring in a climber, they're going up higher. Uh, what do you do for maintenance on those?

>> Ryan Lee: Got to get in a climber then, too. That's why we try not to do it. But when we do, we have to get it back because trees grow and you got to back the screws out, maintain it, service. It, uh, really sucks with a tree climber if you get a big storm and things get turned or a light goes bad or out. So we try to Stay away from that unless you have somebody there. Local kind of stairway now just kind of leading you up to the. The main, uh, lawn upstairs. This M1 came out pretty cool too. This is just another bench, um, in the back. So, like, what do you do interesting about this? So I thought it created a really cool shadow pattern. So we backlit it and you get the shadows as you're walking through. Even if you don't make it to the bench, it's still part of your walk.

>> Greg Schultz: I forgot we were on a live. We have comments, uh, and questions. Patrick Carter's OU technique.

>> Ryan Lee: Oh, yeah, that's. That's illy talk there. University of Oklahoma. So we're. We're the, uh, we graduated, uh, ILY together in 2018.

>> Greg Schultz: That's what you is. Okay.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I graduated. I don't know if Patrick graduated or not, though. I gotta check his, uh, credentials.

>> Greg Schultz: They checked. He didn't. No.

>> Ryan Lee: Okay.

>> Greg Schultz: He still tells people he did, but it. It didn't happen.

What fixture do you use for down lighting and trees? So it can vary

Uh, we got a question from Brad Sloan. What fixture do you go to for down lighting and trees?

>> Ryan Lee: So it can vary, but there's actually a fixture we helped design with a, uh, Clair Lux called the Luna. And it's got multiple, uh, attachment brackets and points. Um, we even. We darken the shroud so that you get less glare putting it down. It's easier to adjust. Uh, we can use internal and external, uh, external hex louvers on it if we want to. Um, but you know, even like Patrick's downlight works as well from Sterling. Um, there's quite a few out there that can do the right thing. So you need something where when you install it, it doesn't sit right up against the tree because the tree is going to grow. So if you're going to use your hanger bolts or if you use a single point, you know, screw or what you're going to use. You need something to you can service maintain over the years. I think we had, uh. Let me look at how many downloads we had in this. Yeah, I have 184. No, I'm sorry, 196 tree lights on this. So we have to go. Yeah, we have to go back in service though. Some of our projects are, you know, half tree lights and down lights. If you give me the tree, you know, it's great. Makes your project better.

>> Greg Schultz: Dude, this. This picture is. This, uh, is incredible. I love it. I think the, the first thing I notice is the fact that it's awesome, but like, I think most people would, uh, would light this completely Differently. They would want to, like, see the bench, see the front and the way you have it so it's lit from the back and you have, like, the dark shadows and then the lighting behind it just to make it more three dimensional and show the depth. It looks so good.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. This goes back to your. Why didn't we sell 732 fixtures? Because that would have screwed it up.

>> Greg Schultz: Definitely would have.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. Sometimes. I know it's funny for me to say, but I am definitely a quality over quantity, uh, person. But you'll see quality in each of the different compositions. So big properties, even small properties, you're looking at compositions. And how do you do these properly to live? Make them functional, but look at them where it makes sense. And they just, uh, you know, Composition. Composition. So this is, uh, Jesse Lukes from, uh, ILY International Landscape Lighting Institute. Um, he was my tree climber for this. Flew him down from Connecticut. Um, and we didn't want to bring a lift back there. We didn't want to kind, uh, of tear up the yard. So he was used on this. And I think those fixtures are probably 70ft up there. Wow. Um, they were super important, so we wanted to light this tree in a different way rather than just uplighting the, uh, um, trunk. So the trunk is actually entirely downlit. And then we light the canopy from the sides. So this is a horrible cell phone picture. Um, this kind of shows you the backyard when you're looking at it. And what it does also, it allows us to light this beautiful fountain off to the side. So that fountain. Fountain, rather than putting lights in it or around it, I'm lighting from 70ft up. And we're able to dial that in. So it hits that area, it makes the yard functional. But it's not just a bunch of lighting everywhere. And then the big, well lights around the canopy are creating that nice, soft light around the entire foliage.

>> Greg Schultz: That's cool. I mean, how close is that? It's hard to tell the distance. It doesn't look like it's. That fountain's that close, though.

>> Ryan Lee: It's not. That's, um. I'd say 50ft at least. So that one, we used a higher lumen output, uh, fixture, and then kind of put it all the way out there, but I think it's like a 1800 lumens because you're 70ft up, shooting 50ft away.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah.

>> Ryan Lee: And then you're expanding it out at a wide angle. So. And what's funny is this tree back here, the small one, I think this has Mike Long making fun of me about this one when he's putting the lights out or helping us. But I think that tree has eight lights on it. The small one. But the reason is because the canopy is so low, you needed more lights to kind of.

>> Greg Schultz: Which one's the small one?

>> Ryan Lee: Hold on, let me see if I can zoom in on my dude. So, hey, you can actually see the lights. So this is a small tree, but you can see how low the canopy is to the ground. You know, we're probably working with a foot, foot and a half. And Nels Peterson, God bless him, uh, one thing he would say is light needs distance. So if you don't have distance, you need more lights. I couldn't use well lights here because they have, uh, under plantings that they put there throughout the spring. And we wanted to light it nice and even. You can see how it's not over lit. If I put four lights here, you wouldn't have this entire tree lit. You'd have part of it lit.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah. You'd have hot spots and dark spots.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. So most landscape lighting people would put two lights on it, maybe one light. You're not lighting the tree.

You downlight the trunk instead of up light it there in photography

>> Greg Schultz: And talk about why you downlight the trunk instead of up light it there.

>> Ryan Lee: I wanted something different. I didn't want hot spots. And then, um, I just wanted to kind of foot the tree really hard. You know, a lot of reasons for downlining would be to foot trees, you know, say I have. They're like. You can tell where they're actually coming from. If you just uplight everything, it kind of looks like you're in outer space. And trees are kind of an outer space with you. So by footing the tree or even if there's some grass around it, you're kind of showing the. The whole landscape around it. So I thought that was the best way to keep it nice and soft. On that scale of a tree being like the centerpiece of the whole lawn.

>> Greg Schultz: And then how far out? I mean, you're. You're willing to go out. You'll put a well light as far as it takes to get that canopy lit because they're obviously not close to the trunk there.

>> Ryan Lee: Um.

>> Greg Schultz: Talk about why you do that, I guess.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I mean, that's where the branches are, so some are 20, 25ft away from the tree. Um, and again, you can see how we evened it out with the down lighting hitting the trunk and then filling it in with that up lighting. In real life also, it kind of gets flat in photography. So obviously in real life, you have more dimension with darkness and brightness. So it's not just looking so flat in real life.

>> Greg Schultz: Well, and even when I asked the question, I feel like, oh, that's a dumb question. But I don't think it is because I see so many people doing projects where they just do the standard with the, well lights, you know, a few feet away from the tree or spotlights, whatever they're using. And again, they get the interior. Like the trunk looks okay and the interior of the tree looks good. And then all of a sudden it's just dark on the edges. And so they need to pull those lights back quite a bit further.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. And then I also see it where they pull the lights further, but then they forget to add one to the trunk. So then they have like a floating canopy and then nothing lighting the trunk. So you can light the trunk with like a more subtle up light, and then you can light the canopy with more. And that's how you fill in the tree.

One thing the client fought me on was lighting this back foliage

All right, so this is another before this, a tree alley in the back again, another section. You can see how these are all different. Um, so you're walking through these zones and getting different, like peaks and secrets. Um, she plants, I think, 2,000 tulips here during the spring. It's beautiful. So you can kind of see how that comes to life at night.

>> Greg Schultz: That's cool.

>> Ryan Lee: So same thing. Up lighting, down lighting, creating the zone. Cool. Uh, little feature here is this bench at the end. So if I didn't light the bench at the end, you'd have no destination to reach, so it'd be pretty lighting. But this gives you somewhere to go. And we're using very small lights below a bench just to create that highlight that tells you, hey, this is my space. But this is where my next space begins.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, very cool.

>> Ryan Lee: Okay. This is one of the coolest areas I've ever seen in my life. Um, it's called the amphitheater. And these are all 40 year old boxwood hedges. So just absolutely crazy ridiculous. And this is kind of what it looks like when you get out there. So the one thing the client fought me on a little bit was lighting this back foliage because it was close to a neighbor. Um, she know this was our focal point, which I agreed with. Um, but she didn't want me to light this back here, so I did it anyways. And then what I did though, is made sure it was subtle enough so that when she came back here, it's just the backdrop. You know, not all these trees are evenly lit. These don't have 10 lights per tree or anything? They're not meant to. They're just kind of meant there to kind of frame this whole main masterpiece, which is here, which is like the most unique, you know, thing I've seen like on any property almost. Well, the other tough thing was obviously everything's low, so we only had these four trees to downlight the different boxwood hedges. And then we're uplighting these to create different focal points throughout here and then using very minimalistic path lights throughout the different areas so you could walk through it easily. But I believe these are just even bullet lights shooting through the foliage to highlight the steps a little bit. They're very raw, natural, you know, moss grown kind of steps.

>> Greg Schultz: So how do you deal with a situation like that when they're like, nah, we don't need that. I mean, we already got 726 lights over here. And besides, that's close to the neighbors. You just say, okay, and then you do it anyway, or do you give them justification or how do you do it?

>> Ryan Lee: I lit it and sent him a picture and I said, do you want me to take them out? You know, okay. I mean, again, it's, you know, I kind of understand that your home, like these people have built these homes from scratch. They designed, you know, the door handle to the wood door, and now you're letting some guy tell you like, hey, no, I'm doing this. You know what I mean? So you have to show respect as well, but you also have to be confident enough to say, hey, this effect is going to be what I'm thinking. And then if I take that away, your lighting is not going to be as good for you as it should be. You know, I didn't make much more money by lighting up that back, um, tree line, but by doing that, you know, my portfolio is better and their property is better as well. So if she said she hated it, I would have ripped it out. You know, Cool. And yes. So, you know, you can like, I fight for design. Sometimes it gets a little uncomfortable with people in the room. But, um, you have to be not pushy, but you have to be confident in what you want. Because like I said, if you undersell something, then, you know, it may, they may actually be more annoyed sometimes. So that's kind of the drone, uh, footage of what that looks like, that area from above, Uh, a little fountain on the side. You know, it's kind of knick knacked in the back. Nothing crazy. But then we want to kind of like a little secret area to get back to. So that's highlighted or highlighted. And then we're down lighting some of the outer branches that come out really far. So kind of like you really can't even see the fountain unless you go back into it, which is lit. But this kind of helps get you back into it as well. Man. There's another. This tree off to the side with the fountain in the background. You can see.

>> Greg Schultz: It's crazy how many just sections there are to this property.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I don't. I don't think I have even pictures of all of them on this presentation.

>> Greg Schultz: It's like seriously, like 30 projects in one.

>> Ryan Lee: And then this tree is actually the, um. We were joking before the show, the red tree. So right now the red tree is a green tree. So you do have to be careful on lighting a red tree with a different Kelvin temperature because it may not be red, uh, all year long. So you got to figure out what's going to work throughout the year, the seasons, or if you. If you wanted to even install two zones of lighting or charge a service to do a lamp change, you know, that's not crazy. We do that sometimes for sea turtles. We do lamp changes and then change it when it's non sea turtle season versus sea turtle season. So maybe have a fall winter kind of thing. Um, or different zones you can turn on, you know, throughout the different seasons. You don't need as much light when there's no leaves on the trees. So maybe a zone turns off some lighting for that. And doing some things like that is not upselling your client. It's impressing them and showing what you do and then making your final project that much better. So we talked about Kelvin temperature here. And then here's, uh, a random frog band at the end of that tree allay. So the frog band is downlit, and if I left it with the down lighting, you wouldn't even really notice them. So on each of the frogs, we have small lights that are at 5,000 kelvin to draw out the blue copper.

>> Greg Schultz: That's cool.

>> Ryan Lee: So now they're a new focal point. You know, like I said, you're framing the scene, but then you're uplighting the frogs. And we did this more recently, almost the same thing. We downlit a sculpture all the way around it, and then we uplit it was a rusty sculpture. So within it, I actually used an orange lamp that doesn't turn out orange. It turns the rust, like, highlights it. And instead of just blending in, it makes it a focal point.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, that's cool.

You downlit the area with one color temperature then uplit with a different

I even like how you downlit the area with one color temperature, then uplit with a different to make it stand out. You got the warm architectural lighting in the back. It's. That's a really cool one.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, just some random piece of this yard. But see, as you're walking through this property, you're thinking about all this different stuff and how it's going to pull together. That's why this picture kind of ends it because it brings you back to the whole piece tied together. All the stuff we just looked at, you know, is here. We have the motor court, we have that driveway we just looked at. We have that pergola, we have that tree alley, we have the fountain, the large tree, we have that little park area it looked like. We have the amphitheater, we have that other fountain and we have that tree. So now that you break it down to the sections. Did I use too many lights or not?

>> Greg Schultz: I think you use just the right amount. I can't think of where you put another one.

>> Ryan Lee: All right, let me record that.

>> Greg Schultz: That's awesome.

Are you using different transformers for different applications? Absolutely. But it really depends on what you're doing

Uh, we had one more question come in. Are you using different transformers for different applications?

>> Ryan Lee: Absolutely. So sometimes, uh, I think we use a lot of direct burials here. We uh, put some of the bushes. But it really depends. I prefer not using direct barrel when we can. But if you have. Yeah, this would be a mix. So sometimes you use them where you don't have a place to mount them or if they're going internally or something. Some of these mounted on the, um, roof line, they need to be, have a different rating because you're putting them on the house. So you don't want to just put like a regular good old landscape lighting transformer on a roof. Um, and yeah, you have different taps. If you're doing longer runs, you'd have to be careful of that too. If you're doing integrated, you don't want to go over 15 volts for a lot of things because you can fry out the integrated stuff or the modular stuff. Um, so yeah, it really depends on the application, what you're doing. Does it need to be dimmable? But if it's dimmable, you also need compatible lamps and a compatible dimmer.

>> Greg Schultz: Very cool, man. I mean that's, that's freaking awesome. Like I told you at the beginning, it's like I, I didn't even know that stuff like this was possible. I was just living in my world, my head down, working, doing stuff, doing things. I was grateful to do my first twenty thousand dollar project. Then I did a bigger One. And then I did a bigger one and stuff like that. Until I met you. I'm like, wow. Like, okay. You know, and then now I've been to Illy, and so I know you can put 37 lights on a, uh, Japanese maple.

>> Ryan Lee: And so we have one. We have one tree. We did 36 lights on in real life, so it can be done. And she wanted it subtle. That's why we had so many lights.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, that was subtle.

>> Ryan Lee: It was. They were all like, one waters.

>> Greg Schultz: No, it's just. It's really cool, man. I mean, you. You've really carved out a niche for yourself. And, um, obviously you've got the portfolio now. So if I'm a. If I'm someone who gets presented with an opportunity like that, and I'm like, uh, where would I start? I'm going to call you because I'm like, dude, help me do this. And such a learning opportunity to be able to work with you side by side and see how you deal with clients and what the language is that you use. Like, you mentioned, and how your confidence comes through. And I think that's a big part of it is when you're talking like, people just believe you so.

>> Ryan Lee: Well, because it's true.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah. If they don't believe you, then it's going to be like 700 and what number of fixtures. That sounds crazy. But once they believe you, then of course, like, when can you get started?

>> Ryan Lee: Yep. Absolutely.

Greg has a new game he wants us to play. It's called you make the Call

>> Greg Schultz: Um, so, hey, I gotta, um. I. I prepared this thing we gotta do. I know we're short on time, but I got a new. I got a new game, a new segment that I think is gonna be fun because it's gonna help us get to know Greg a little bit. Your. Your business, your personal side. Can we play the game?

>> Ryan Lee: I guess I'm scared.

>> Greg Schultz: It's. It's not scary. It's called you make the Call.

>> Ryan Lee: Do I keep my clothes on?

>> Greg Schultz: Well, no, first things first. It's called you make the call, but every game called you make the call, take your clothes off. It's awkward, it's weird. But don't worry, it's a podcast. People can't see this unless they're watching on YouTube or Facebook.

This segment is brought to us by Call Source. Call Source helps busy lighting contractors

So, um, okay, so this is a new segment we're going to start. This is the first time we're doing it. It's brought to us by Call Source. Okay. Call Source is actually a new partner of ours, and basically what they do is they help busy lighting contractors that don't always have time to follow up on every unbooked call, unsold estimate, form, fill, canceled appointment, all that. Well, that's where Call Source comes in. So they're us based, outbound, uh, call center, and they basically act as an extension of your team. So they'll use, uh, live CSRs, uh, to reconnect with prospects, schedule appointments, help recover revenue that may have otherwise slipped through the cracks. So if you guys want to learn more about Call Source, just go to callsource .com, schedule a demo. But they are sponsoring this segment. Okay, this is cool.

Sometimes you just have to make the call as a business owner

So it's called you make the call. And, Greg, it's basically, you know, as a business owner, you got tough decisions to make in life and business, so sometimes you just have to make the call. So let me ask you, would you rather double your revenue but work double the hours or keep revenue the same and cut your hours in half?

>> Ryan Lee: Uh, revenue the same and cut my hours in half.

>> Greg Schultz: All right, I was, uh. That one was actually brought to us by Erica. So you have to, uh, stop. You have to stop working. Um, would you rather have a business partner who's brilliant but unreliable or reliable but mediocre? Mediocre. I can't even read my own writing.

>> Ryan Lee: Mediocre, I think brilliant but unreliable, because I'll handle it. But then if you come up with the awesome stuff, then we're good.

>> Greg Schultz: Okay. All right, I don't need.

>> Ryan Lee: I don't need a paper weight around her.

Would you rather have to sing every sentence or whisper everything for a week

>> Greg Schultz: All right, um, would you rather get one unskippable zoom call added to your calendar every day or lose the ability to use your phone for a week?

>> Ryan Lee: Well, the zoom call, because, like, you could just do it wherever you're at, right?

>> Greg Schultz: It's. It's. You can't skip it. You got to do it every day for a week. Or you can't, uh, you can't use your phone for a week.

>> Ryan Lee: I'll do the zoom call.

>> Greg Schultz: All right, I've added it to your calendar. Would you rather have to sing every sentence you say for a full day or whisper everything for a week?

>> Ryan Lee: A whispering would be fun. Yeah, I'm down for whispering. It'd be really creepy.

>> Greg Schultz: It would be creepy. I mean, think about that.

>> Ryan Lee: How would you like to buy some lights?

>> Greg Schultz: Maybe your closing rate will go up. I don't know.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, you could be afraid of me. Afraid of me coming back at night.

>> Greg Schultz: And I, uh. For some reason, I thought when you whisper, you have to say baby, but maybe you don't. Hey, baby, you want some lights? You don't have to say baby. You can just whisper better um, okay. So you'd rather whisper than sing every sentence? Um, I thought maybe you'd sing. You go to all these concerts. I mean, you know.

>> Ryan Lee: I know, but the whispering would be more fun. I like listening to people sing. That's not one of my, uh, skill sets. Yeah, unless I'm. Unless it's karaoke and I'm really smashed.

>> Greg Schultz: All right, maybe we can work that into one of our events. Would you rather fight a one or. Yeah, would you rather fight one horse sized duck or 100 duck sized horses?

>> Ryan Lee: So I'm doing Jiu Jitsu again. So I'll take on the horse sized duck. Oh, yeah, okay. Um, it'd be way better to eat at the end too. Like when you take them out, I put them on the whole.

>> Greg Schultz: Can you eat a horse sized duck? I mean, that's a big try.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I would try.

>> Greg Schultz: What would be. So you with your Jiu Jitsu, what have you learned? What skill do you. Are you gonna, like, take it down with?

>> Ryan Lee: Uh, easiest one's rear naked. Or you could do a rear naked choke. Or you could do a triangle to get them down.

>> Greg Schultz: Cool. I don't know what those mean, but sounds. Sounds like it might work.

>> Ryan Lee: Neither does a duck. Yeah, exactly.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, I think like a horse sized duck sometimes.

Would you rather stay at a Holiday Inn for a year or not leave town

Would you rather stay at a Holiday Inn for a year or not be able to leave town for a year?

>> Ryan Lee: Oh, I have to leave town. You know that answer. Even though I'm the Marriott, uh, king. Um, if I can't leave town, we got problems.

>> Greg Schultz: So you. So you would rather go stay at Holiday Inn for all of your shenanigans?

>> Ryan Lee: Not do shenanigans. Yes, for sure. Yeah.

>> Greg Schultz: You have to. You have to stay put. Wow, dude, I just.

>> Ryan Lee: You know me, I just won't go back to the hotel. I'll just stay out all night and all day and I'll be all right.

>> Greg Schultz: That's impressive. I. I didn't. I, I didn't even think that you would, yeah. Sleep in a Holiday Inn, like, no matter what, Mr. Marriott.

Would you rather use path lights on every job forever or down lights forever

All right, uh, last one. Would you rather have to use path lights on every job forever or never be able to use down lights forever?

>> Ryan Lee: So there's no quantity in this question. So I'll go with path light. I can throw it in a corner.

>> Greg Schultz: You have to use, uh, sorry. Yeah, that's a good point. You have to use 5%. Would you have. Would you rather have to use. Yeah, 5% of your lights have to be path lights on every job forever.

>> Ryan Lee: That's good. Well, I'll I'll just downlight the path light to help it make like. So that's another design, uh, secret. If you're uplighting things with well lights, if you actually downlight the well light, it makes it less harsh because you're not looking at some bright spot in the grass. So I'll just downlight my path lights. Stopping them. Yeah. Cool.

>> Greg Schultz: All right, so you're going to do the 5% path lights, uh, of your lights are going to be path lights. You'll just put down lights on them to, to disguise them. Yeah.

>> Ryan Lee: That'll increase revenue as well. Are expensive.

>> Greg Schultz: You're welcome. All right, well, that's kind of cool. I don't know. Maybe we'll keep doing this segment, maybe not. I don't know. I thought it's kind of cool because get a little insight on, on how you would make decisions as a business leader as, as in your personal life. So that's kind of fun.

Greg, you're working on some massive projects now. Um, I mean, we're talking seven figure projects

Well, um, I know we've gone over a little bit of our time, but, uh, I think the only other thing I want to ask you. Do you have a couple more minutes?

>> Ryan Lee: I'm in. Yep.

>> Greg Schultz: Okay. Um, it's really just about business and I appreciate walking us through the design and. Because I, I think that's important. I think people, if you guys are listening to this and you didn't get to see the screen, go watch this on YouTube, go look it up on my Facebook, reach out to Greg, whatever. Like, just go see it because it's really, really inspiring. It's really, really cool to see these things, um, to show us like, what's possible. Um, and, and Greg, we were just talking before the show, like, you're working on a, some massive projects now. I'm talking like you don't even care about the numbers. But I do, just because I think it's cool. Um, I mean, we're talking seven figure projects.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. So we just finished a seven figure and then we have one that's close to multiple seven figures that, uh, someone I've been designing for years that I'm waiting on the property to catch up. These are both residential properties, so just backyards. But, um, the other one, we've been paid for design up to now. And then the property is finally catching up to where it needs to be for install. So that'll be kind of phased out throughout. But, but yeah, we've had some, uh, pretty cool ones. And it's the same thing. We have the right client with more complex properties with the right areas, and we kind of Know what they're looking for in quality and like I said, being paid on one of those. We know we did our project right, uh, we're going to go back and do service on that property probably every month. And um, you know, other properties we go minimum twice a year, bigger ones that are more complex, you go more often and it creates less time and less fixing you have to do when you're there.

>> Greg Schultz: That's just insane, dude. I mean seriously, congrats on what you're doing over there.

Short says he's focused on growing his business and replacing himself

Um, obviously these big projects are amazing, but you're really focused on like growing your business and replacing yourself. In the last, since I've known you, I don't know how many years it's been now, but you've really done a great job of doing that. Talk to me about like, what's changed in your business as you've grown, like, how has your role, how has your responsibilities changed over the last several years?

>> Ryan Lee: So I'm getting, I'm trying to and doing it, getting back to what I'm best at, which is design and presentations. Um, so we now have a designer on staff, we have an operations manager, we have a general manager, we have a lead, ah, foreman and we have a crew out in the field and we have somebody handling a service. So it's getting rid of all the stuff that, you know, I could do. But if I focus on this other thing, that's how I can get the better projects and also basically have a better life as well. When I, you know, I'm happier and doing more things and all that, I become a better designer for my clients. So why would I want, not want to do that for them? So it's really coming with delegation. You know, this is a thing that you've really helped me out with. You know, a lot of people say that you're not in, you know, not here to help out landscape, lighting people or you're just doing other things, but it's not true. You know, you've really helped my business, um, and the people I've met through you as well have really helped keep me in check as well. So meeting other people that are really good at something else and then learning from them, taking that on. But it's me getting back into the true design and the true, um, development of the company and helping the development of the entire honestly industry is what I try to do. You know, I'm not saying I've done that, but I try to be involved with different organizations and you know, helping the industry as a whole do my Part to proceed in the future, um, with design centric lighting being more responsible. And then also, you know, we can't forget we have to pay the bills. So you have to actually be able to charge a number where you can have these different things be in business in five years, 10 years. When you say that you're going to warranty these products and then have the resources to do that as well. Um, where you're able to provide better for your employees, your family, and then the clients are still happy with the product and don't feel ripped off. And there's a difference between spending a lot of money and being expensive and being overpriced and being a ripoff. So if you charge a lot of money and you're not worth it and you haven't developed your design skills or providing the best product, that's where you can really get yourself into trouble. Get a bad reputation and say, hey, we charged a bunch of money, but it's not what we wanted or it starts falling apart in a few years and you didn't do your property right.

>> Greg Schultz: That's cool, man. Well, it's just been cool to see from my perspective, you, uh, like find, find out like what kind of business owner you want to be. Because it's hard, man. Anyone who owns any business, I mean, I just have so much respect for them because it's freaking. They're hard days. And you're finding your lane, you're finding, okay, this is what I, this is what I'm good at. This is what I want to do. This is what my capacity is to do. And then you're replacing those things that you're like, I don't really want to run the business on the day to day that doesn't light me up. Like, I just want to go do these awesome designs and meet with people and walk these projects and nerd out on lighting. And I think that's the name of the game. There's so many talented designers out there that are good installers, good designer, whatever it is, like, it's their passion and they're letting the business run them instead of the other way around. So, you know, kudos to you for like having the courage to do it. And I see a lot of people start to do what you're doing. They're like, you know, hire the person and it doesn't work out. And I know it hasn't been a perfect road for you. Um, but you don't give up. You're not like, oh, ah. Like the easier thing to do in Short term is just retreat. And I guess, screw it, I'll just do it myself, you know.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, I've been. I've been on four trips in the last month. Three, uh, were for fun, and one was actually to go and design lighting in another state in the Hamptons. We're doing a couple projects up there, but I was able to go away and not come back to a, uh, firestorm kind of thing.

>> Greg Schultz: That's way cool.

>> Ryan Lee: I'm still needed and I'm still, you know, have my roles and I'm still important, but I come back to check things or I get updates and, you know, that's how it should be. And actually, it's what makes the employee's life better too. Like, give them a role. What are they supposed to do? What do they understand? Like, you know, and everybody kind of stays in their lane is always a tricky part. People try to, you know. You know, we call it scope, creep and lighting. But even in job roles too, like, somebody's trying to do this and that. I'm like, you focus on that, then focus on that, and then we all work together as a team. But that's what makes the most sense to make this happen.

As you transition from doing a lot of it yourself to delegating

>> Greg Schultz: Well, as you've gone through that kind of transition from doing a lot of it yourself to, you know, having the overwhelm and, you know, now you're delegating and training and stuff like that, what's been the hardest part of that?

>> Ryan Lee: Um, finding the right people. Um, it always. I think that's. Any business owner would say that it's finding the right person. And, you know, you always have changes. You have people that have been with you a long time, and they either leave you or you lose them or whatever. But, you know, what separates, you know, the good from the bad or whatever is being able to get over that hump, change something out and kind of readapt. And maybe some of the. A lot of times re adaptations have been turned out better, where you're thinking, oh, my God, it's the end of the world. What am I going to do? You work your way through it and you're like, oh, well, why did I deal with that crap back then? So a lot of the times you just have to kind of stick it through, kind of figure out what was wrong, what you could do better, and actually improve your business during that process.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, yeah, well said. Because honestly, like, anytime you do something new, you're going to have some type of, you know, things don't always work out the first time. So there's Going to be a learning curve there. And, uh, that's where you can learn a lot from. You're going to have to make decisions from a different mindset. A phrase that, um, I like a lot is what got you here won't get you there. So sometimes it's those people that were like, hey, yeah, they helped us get to this spot, but they're not ready for the 2.0, they're not ready for the 3.0 version. They weren't used to accountability, they weren't used to SOPs, like, all the things that a real business needs to function and to grow.

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah. Like when you go to Best Buy, the owner of Best Buy doesn't come up and say, hey, do you need help with picking out a computer? You know, there's different people that help you do that, and he has other things to do.

>> Greg Schultz: Yeah, I know. I can't remember how much percentage, but Jeff Bezos, you know, he's like the one of the richest guys in the world. He owns like 7 or 9 or 13% of Amazon now, like, that's crazy. And we want 100% and we wanted to be in charge. It's like, yeah, why? Yeah, just do what lights you up. Well, that's cool, man. Um, if people do want to get a hold of you, uh, whether they want to hire you, they want to work with you. What, what's your website? What's the best way to, uh, get in touch with you?

>> Ryan Lee: Yeah, luxury illumination .net, um, or get lit li. com. they both take you the same spot. But that's the best website. We got a form on there. It's probably the easiest way. They can always bug you and, and get my email.

>> Greg Schultz: Don't bug me, just bug Greg. Uh, well, seriously, man, uh, thanks for everything you do. I know, um, you're, you're, you're a, um, you're an inspiration for the industry. You've done a lot for lots of different organizations, uh, constantly giving back and helping, uh, advance this industry. So thank you. Uh, I don't know if I can thank you on behalf of the industry, but I'm sure people would thank you if I asked them for a vote. Uh, but thanks for doing that, man. And just keep, keep killing it, man. Keep inspiring us. Keep getting out there and, and doing your thing because, uh, we need you to, uh, to keep, keep doing these things. So appreciate your time today, Greg. Um, as always, thanks a ton.

>> Ryan Lee: Will do. Thank you. And there's a lot of other people doing more than me even. So. Yeah, there's a lot of people, volunteers for these organizations, um, that do amazing stuff in the background. So if you see one of them, make sure you thank them. At these conferences, events, and all that, you'd be surprised at what people are doing to make free charity work, you know, to make the industry better.

>> Greg Schultz: Absolutely. I'm with you there. All right, guys, go sell $760 million trillion light project. Have fun. See you guys.