Lighting for Profits - Episode 261

What does it take to build a career, a company, and a legacy from knocking doors? In this episode, Sam Taggart—CEO of D2D Experts and Founder of D2DCON—shares his journey from selling curb addresses and magazine subscriptions to becoming one of the most influential voices in the door-to-door sales industry. With 400+ personal alarm accounts sold, executive experience, multiple seven-figure businesses, and thousands of sales reps trained, Sam breaks down the mindset, sales strategies, leadership principles, and recruiting lessons that helped him rise to the top.

Get ready for a conversation about sales, leadership, recruiting, resilience, and what it really takes to become a sales carnivore.

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Episode Transcript

Welcome to Lighting for Profits.

All light, All light, All light, powered by EmeryAllen. Here is your host, Ryan Lee. Oh, uh, light, all light, all light. It's gonna be an awesome show, guys. Welcome, welcome, welcome. I'm Ryan Lee, your host of Lighting for Profits, powered by EmeryAllen. And, uh, today's actually gonna get a lot of fun. Um, we're going to be talking about, you know, everyone wants more leads. And, uh, we're going to talk about how you can actually dominate your sales game, increase your not just revenues, but your profits without spending more money on marketing. So gonna be a really cool episode. How to increase your sales, how to increase your bottom line without spending more money on marketing. Like, is that even possible? It is. And we're going to talk about several ways you can do that on today's show. So, um, super stoked. I'm going to be joined by the founder of D2D, experts, also, uh, written several books, Sam, uh, Taggart. And, um, it's kind of funny because, like, um, I've been. I've gotten to know Sam a little bit better over the last couple years, and I've been to his events and kind of seen him speak and stuff like that. And in his world, like, you guys, if. If he goes into, like, one of his, like, events, it's like, there's like a line to see him and, like, he's like, a big deal. But if he came into the outdoor lighting industry, he could just, like, sit in the chairs and, like, no one would know who he is. And so I'm really trying to, like, plug into these other networks in these communities because there's so much value, um, that they can provide. And so that's what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to get Sam, like, involved with the outdoor lighting community because he's just a beast and he's done incredible things at a young age and already impacted so many lives. And I want more lives to be impacted in the outdoor lighting space. So, um, we got Sam Taggart coming on, um, and did you guys know this? It's the number one landscape lighting show in Sandy, Utah. So that's kind of cool. Uh, I grew up in Sandy, and, uh, just so happens that Sam's, uh, showroom, his office and all that stuff is, uh, in, um, in Sandy, Utah. So kind of cool going to visit his place. Um, I went and drove by my old house that I grew up, um, on the way there and stuff like that. So Sandy, Utah, in the house. Um, just a reminder, guys, I know it's a ways out. But as you know, I like to promote things, I like to market things. I like to make sure that when we do something, we do it right. We got Light It Up Expo happening March 1 through 4, Las Vegas. It's going to be epic. We have discounted room block rates. Um, and we just sent an email the other day where you've got a promo code. This is an early bird special. I don't even know how long it's going to last. It probably just depends on, like, how many people take advantage of it. Um, but we are doing an early bird, so check your email. We sent you a promo code. And, uh, go into your email, look for Light It Up Expo and get, uh, your ticket now, because that, we're definitely not going to keep that going for very long. And that's going to be your best deal of the year. Um, hey, before we have, uh, Sam on big shout out to Lights for Decorators, uh, Jimmy Tompkins. You guys know, like, um, I've been to a lot of his training events and stuff like that. I mean, yeah, you can go buy product from anyone, but one of the things I love about Lights for Decorators and Jimmy and his team is they're big on helping you grow your business. So, um, they're there to help you win your local market. So if you're looking for holiday lighting, landscape lighting, permanent lighting, check out Lights for Decorators dot com. And, uh, they have tons of free trainings and lots of different stuff. So go to their website, check them out. And also, I was thinking, um, I was thinking of like, okay, what can I talk about today? Because I told you at the beginning of the show, we're going to talk about ways that you can increase your sales, increase your bottom line, make more money in your business, which, that should be one of your goals. Some of you guys feel guilty for making money. And I'm like, you're. You're a business. Like, you're not a. Not for profit. You're supposed to make money. Don't feel bad making money. You should make a ton of money because then you can pay your people more. You can deliver a better experience to your customers. Like, it's not only. Okay. Like, it's what you're supposed to do. Um, so we're gonna, we're gonna talk about a couple different ways that you can make more money in your business without spending more on marketing. In fact, what if I told you that your clients, your actual paying clients, would write you a check every single year? Okay. They Write you a check to pay for your marketing budget. Like they're investors. Like they invest in your company and they pay for your advertising budget. Would you think I'm crazy? Well, this might be either the dumbest or the most genius marketing hack you've ever heard. So, um, before I tell you exactly what it is and how you can implement it in your business, let me take you back a little bit. Uh, when I started my landscape lighting business, okay, so when I started my outdoor lighting business, I was literally like in my brother's hot tub. We were talking about blowing up this window cleaning business and everything. And he tells me about, you know, we were, we were going to sell $250 window cleanings. This was in 2007. And he's like, man, I just did these two jobs. They were $4,000 each and they were landscape lighting. And I was like, what?

No way.

Like, if someone would give me $4,000, I would rather just like knock doors and sell $4,000 lighting jobs and $250 window cleaning jobs. And, um, that's how it got started. And I didn't know much about the industry. Um, I knew it was like high ticket. I was like, 4,000 bucks. So like, you know, people are only going to hire us once, unlike window cleaning. Because window cleaning, like you could sell like quarterlies and stuff like that. But this is like a one time deal. So I was like, well, we got to figure out how to increase our ticket from 4,000 to 5,000. Like, we got to get as much money as possible. And you know what? At first I was right. Until I wasn't. Okay, I found out a couple things. Number, uh, one, and if you've been in the industry longer than like 12 months, you know that lighting is addictive. And this is such a huge benefit we have in this industry. Because even if someone like is like super wealthy and they have tons of money and they can afford your lighting proposal, that's $50,000. They might not trust you fully with $50,000. They might trust you with like 10 or $20,000, but they might not fully trust you to like go full, full out, right? And so, um, they tend to kind of take over, especially if you're newer in the industry. Like I was, people go, well, let's not do that. Let's take this. And you're kind of like, I'll take anything. So like, okay, that's fine, we'll just take out some lights. They tend to overpower your expertise. And um, so whether it's because you Suck at design or you get overpowered. Like, that's just a common thing that happens to newer people, uh, that are learning design. And so what happens is, like, they get lights in their house, and then naturally they're like, hey, you know what? We should add lights on those trees. And you're like, yeah, those were the trees I was telling you to light. And so luckily, it's addictive, right? And they're like, you know what? This is really cool. And then we want to go here, and we want to go here. And they're adding zones, and they're six months later. They're like, hey, I know we started in the front yard, but, like, we should do our backyard a year later, like, whatever it is, right? Um, and the other thing is, like, we had clients that after, like, two, three years, they would move and they would either get a promotion or sell a business or just inherit some money or something. I don't know. They just invented more money. They would get a bigger house. And so now all of a sudden, that client turned into just more money. Same client, different house, right? So the cool thing is lighting is addictive. I learned that. The second thing I learned is I didn't even know anything about maintenance plans. I literally thought I was just trying to collect $4,000 or $5,000 if I could, and I wasn't thinking about recurring revenue. And at first, this was in 2007, so most of our installs were not led. They were halogen, and. Or all of them were halogen. And we'd have clients that would call like, hey, I got a light out. And so I'd go out and change the light bulb or whatever. And then I don't remember where I got the idea from, um, or if it was like, a client that was, you should do this, or whatever. But we were like, hey, why don't we just sign people up for maintenance plans where we just proactively come out, clean their system, check it, and not have to be, like, reactive. And so we just made up a price. We made up a plan and started it, and then went from there. I didn't have a podcast to listen to. I didn't go to Light it Up Expo. There was no. There was no thing to teach me. Okay. And so, um, this is where things got interesting. Um, you know, of course I wanted to make money off of maintenance plans. I mean, that was, like, the purpose. Um, but it was. Something happened way bigger than just the $600 a year that I was collecting, um, because $600 a year I mean, you know, it adds up, but it's not like anyone has like 20,000 clients, you know, so, um, you have hundreds of clients. And so I was like, yeah, that's cool, we made some extra money or whatever. But here's the coolest thing about our maintenance plans is they kept us in front of our clients. So this is when we started to notice our average lifetime value of a client like skyrocket. Because it wasn't just the one time, four or five thousand dollars job. This is what kept us in front of them and reminded them that we are awesome and that their lights are awesome. Right? And so now all of a sudden, we were able to upsell more, more backyards. We were able to get more referrals from people. Um, we were able to get more, um, word of mouth. Okay, not like maybe a direct referral, but someone on their street saw our truck because it was wrapped. And total side note, like, some of you guys don't even have wrapped trucks. And some of your wrapped trucks just suck. Like, it doesn't even communicate the value that you do. So you gotta, you gotta look at that. But if you have a really good rap, then like, you're just missing out on opportunities. Like you, you need a, you need a really good wrap. Okay. Not one that you design by yourself. Like, hire a professional, get it done. But we noticed our clients value like started to like increase like crazy. And so if you're one of those people that like me, like, I just didn't know I didn't have it in place. This should become a top priority for you. Um, and how this is, this is how I, how I would recommend doing it. You can do it however you want. Minimum $600 per year. Um, and then whatever, like your total contract value is just do 5%. And you can adjust this based on your like, geography and your company numbers and stuff like that. Like know how much it costs you to run your business and all that stuff and how much you pay for labor. But generally speaking, you can get away with $600 minimum for the year. That includes two visits, plus unlimited, uh, service calls. So set up kind of like a pest control company where like you're going to come out twice a year. They don't call you. You call them red carpet, white glove. They also can call back for, um, if there's any issues. Now that can get scary because what if someone calls you back like tons of times, right? So, um, other people do it where they charge like a membership fee, like 99 bucks or 200 bucks for the year, then that gets you a discounted to their labor and then they charge an hourly price. So lots of different ways to do it. I personally like flat rate pricing. Um, it's pretty easy to do, it's easy to track, it's easy to like be like transparent with your clients and all that stuff. You just need to do like job cost. Just like you should be job costing your installs, you need to job cost your maintenance plan. So when we started to do that and audit our process, we found this one lady had called us 11 times or we had been to her property 11 times and that means two were like planned we were going to do that, but nine other times we went out. And so if she paid $600, like you can do the math pretty easy. We definitely lost money having her as a client. So when you have those situations, you call the client and you fire them. You tell them like, listen, we came out to your property 11 times. We can't keep the price at 600 bucks. If you want to stay on this type of program, we need to charge you, you know, $1800 or whatever the number is. And then they can choose to, uh, accept or not, or they can just go to hourly and then call you when they need you. It's just reactive, not proactive. So, um, my main thing is, I promise you guys this, if you will let your clients pay for your marketing, that's what happens when you go out and do a maintenance plan. I mean, I, I, again we're talking about a for profit business here, so take this with a grain of salt, but I would almost be willing to break even or lose money on my maintenance plans because of the back end offer that it provides. It stacks up cash on the back end because now you're, you're adding to a zone, you're doing a second house, a third house, you're getting more referrals, you're getting more word of mouth. Like the value that it provides to your business is much larger than the $600, the $1,200 a year that that recurring gives you. Okay, so now I'm not saying to underprice those and make it be a loss leader. Like if you can do everything great, like make tons of money there, uh, on your recurring and make tons of money on your installs. But I'm just saying that's how valuable it is. There's so much hidden profit in your business that your clients should be writing you this check for $600 a year, $1200 a year. Whatever it is. And that as long as you're really good at branding, marketing, wrap trucks, customer customer communications, you're doing what you say you're going to do, that's going to, like, give you a huge boost in business. Um, and it. That's. To me, the residual is like, now I turned a customer from a $12,000 customer to a $25,000 customer, and then they referred someone else who's in a $15,000 customer, and then that person turned into a $30,000 customer. That's the benefit of staying in front of your clients with a maintenance plan. So that's just one way that you can grow your business without spending more money on marketing. And, um, when we have Sam on, we're going to talk about some other ways as well. So, um, let's see. Oh, there it is. Guys, don't. Don't be a bad friend. And I'm not. I don't want to be a bad friend. So I'm not going to let you install garbage lamps. If you want less, more referrals, more repeat business, just stick with Emory Allen. Emory Allen makes premium LED lamps for lighting professionals who demand the best. So if you want the hookup, just email my man Jackson. His email is Jackson L. Because his last name starts with L. Jackson the letter lry allen. com. and he will hook you up with that discounted contractor pricing. Just mention that you heard about him here at, uh, Lighting for Profits, and he will hook you up. So email jackson link@emoryallen .com. all right, guys, I think it's time I told you in the outdoor lighting space, not a lot of people know who this guest is, but after today's episode, you're going to be like, wait, what? Hopefully you guys have an awesome epiphany and realize, okay, maybe there's something else I can do in my business. So I think it's time to get the music going and get our guests coming. Are you ready? Welcome to the show, Mr. Sam Taggart. What's up, Sam?

How are you doing? I love it. Great intro.

Oh, thanks, man. I mean, my life is amazing. Anytime I get to just nerd out on business and lighting and talk with cool people, like, why would I complain?

It's hard to complain. Hard to complain.

Yeah, it's. It's pretty fun. This is definitely my favorite, uh, day of the week to just do this show because we just have cool conversations. So thanks for carving out time of your day and hanging, uh, out with the outdoor lighting community. I'm not sure if you heard? But, like, when I. When I go to your stuff, like, there's like, a line of people, you know, you have to, like, come in, like, back entrances and hide and stuff like that, you know? And then, like, you can come to an outdoor lighting community, and you could just, like, be sitting in the middle row with me, and, like, no one would even know who you are. So it's probably a nice break for you.

It is so nice. Um, so nice. And I'm privileged to be on the show and excited to share some stuff and have a good combo.

I love it, man. Well, I was looking. The last time you were on the show was quite a while ago, and, uh, you had long hair. And then, um. What happened? What's behind the new look?

I, uh. It's funny, actually. It was like, I went through a two years of just, like, I don't want to be on social media. I don't want people to take me, like they used to serious, and, like, I actually, like, kind of revolted a little bit, so I grew my hair out. And then, um. Oh, shoot. I actually know this. Hold on. So then what happened was I am selling a company right now, and I'm working, or I'm working on a private equity play. Essentially. We're calling it Ford Strategic Equity, where we're bolting a bunch of companies together. And I'm in these meetings with all these bankers and M and A, and I'm like, okay, these. I was just like, I probably should be taken serious. You know what I mean? I'm like, there's this element of, like, Alex or Mosey, right? Like, he's probably fought his own uphill battle based on perception, where now he's got the clout. But it's like he walks in a room with a tank top and long hair, like, naturally not going to take him as serious until you understand his background. And I felt like I was constantly getting that. My dad, I used to have long hair, like, 10 years ago, and I remember my dad looked at me and he goes, sam, would you tell everybody, uh, that knocks doors to have long hair like you would? Because you're the guy that they look to, like, you know, you're their idol, right? And I'm like, no, because I think everybody needs their fair shot, right? Like, I think you got to look the part. And if you don't have the swagger, like, you need everything going your direction as you can, and adding complexity to that wouldn't be worth it. So anyways, it kind of round two of ten years Later I'm like, yep, I'm back into that same boat.

So that's crazy, actually, because you're right. Like, you, once you earn it, like, Alex Hormozi has earned it, I feel like then it's like, yeah, do whatever you want. But I struggle with that a little bit because I'm like, I just want to wear a T shirt everywhere. And why do I have to wear a collared shirt? Like, why do I have to shave? I just want to be me.

Yeah. Yeah.

But, you know, I've noticed, like, I shaved my beard a while ago and people don't respect me. I'm like, like, the beard commands respect and authority.

Has it? No. Oh, I look like a 12 year old still, dude. Like, if I saved, I literally look so young. It's bad.

Yeah. Kind of crazy. Um, well, either way, I enjoyed the long hair. The short hair doesn't really matter. It's been, um, pretty cool because the last time I had you on the show, like, I had met you, I maybe seen some of your stuff, but I didn't really know who Sam Taggart was and stuff like that. But now I've like, attended one of your boot camps. Got to learn directly from you, your team, um, attended D2D con. Kind of seeing how you run a team and how you've built a team, which is like, just quite impressive. Um, where, where do you get this drive from? Like, because you used to be an employee, you used to knock doors, you used to do all this stuff. Like, where, where are you getting this passion from?

Correction, I've never been an employee and you haven't.

I thought you used to knock doors.

I still 1099.

Okay. Okay.

I think that's the difference. Like, so I have been part of companies as a 1099, but I've never had a W2M wage. Surprisingly fun fact about Sam. So, like, ever since, you know, it's hilarious because this random kid, Sterling, texts me today, 12:14, and he says, I love seeing your stuff. Um, but random memory and can't decide if it's true. For some reason, I remember you being in my house one random summer afternoon with a backpack full of spray paint cans, knocking doors, selling a fresh paint job on the house, numbers painted on the curb in Fresno. If yes, that's a funny memory. Like, is that. And I was just random today. I haven't talked to this kid in 20 something years. This is high school. And he's like, was that a thing? Like, I don't know what he's doing with his life right now. Like, I didn't even know he had my phone number. And, uh, did that happen?

Was that a real memory?

Oh, it was. It was. I go, that was my first hustle, bro. We were paying Curves, and, like, that's how we made money in high school is I had a bunch of my buddies working for me. Um, and then I went and did alarm system sales, and then I did solar, and now I've actually helped a lot of permanent lighting companies. Um, you know, it just helped over a decade. But. But what's funny is I just never went and took the job at Starbucks. You know what I mean? Like, it was just go hustle for some money.

That's cool. Like, were your parents entrepreneurial or. How did you. How did that happen?

Well, I grew up in Park City, so I actually was in the richest micropolitan in America. Bougie and bougie, my street. If you were to buy a house on my street, I think the average home price would be about 12 million. Um, and that. And there's $30 million houses on my neighborhood street. You know what I mean? So it's just like, I grew up in a weird. A weird eco environment. My dad was a land developer, and then he started a company called OGO Bags. Um, and then you started that. Yeah, I got an ogo.

I got, like, two of them. That's awesome.

I didn't know that. And then he then went on and did another business. But, like, he was the type, though, that, like, all my friends were driving Hummers and nice Tacomas to high school. But he was. I was like, dad, I want a car. He's like, you got two legs. It's not that he couldn't afford it. It was. He chose not to entitle us. And I think that, like, essence, that he, you know, he still shops at the DI or Salvation army, he still has, like, this gritty. You know what I mean? Like, he was a golf. He was a. He was a member of the Salt Lake Country Club. But then, like, now he's a member at Murray Parkway. Like, he doesn't care. Like, you know, just, like. I don't know, uh, whatever. Like, you just. It's more about the. The hustle and. And creating things. So I think I picked up on that from a young age. And. And now I've been able to help thousands of business owners, and that's my mission, is just to help people scale their companies and in the direct sales, belly to belly. That's why I wrote the book eat what you Kill and you know, pushing more carnivore type hustle mentalities.

Have you found that there's certain people that have that natural tendency or ability? Because when I, when I was young I grew up here in Utah and I just wanted to, like we didn't have money, so I was like, well, I want money. So I shoveled walks, I made 25 bucks and then I go do two or three of those on a Saturday and I felt like I was rich. But then the world, like I didn't have an entrepreneurial like mentor or dad or anything like that. So I just went to school and I went to work and like I thought that's what you're supposed to do. But then I kept coming back like, no, I feel this draw. Uh, I can't tell if there's people that own businesses that I should talk out of it. Cause I'm like, you don't have what it takes. Or if I should keep pushing. Like, no, uh, you can do this. You can eat what you kill. Like what, what are your thoughts on that?

Yeah, I think there's different architects and I love the book the E Myth, if you haven't read that one. And he talks about the manager and the, you know, entrepreneur and the, you know. So I think if you look at like profiling, you know, I'm a red, yellow, right? So I have the social ability to sell and then I have the drive, ability to punch through a wall, get hit with another boulder and then punch through that and just handle every speed bump. I've been rejected, spit on, you know, all the things. So now I go into business. I had a, I had basically a 15 year sprint of getting my face kicked in. So when I started a company, it was like I wasn't afraid to go get my face kicked in and get gritty and go sell somebody. I think when somebody starts a business and they're like, oh, I don't want to talk to people though, I'm like, so, oh, uh, uh, so how do you plan on getting customers? You know what I mean? Like, well, my website. Okay, so they're just going to self check out their landscaping. Like, no, you know what I mean? And you know, so I think there's archetypes of like, you know, an analytical type person or a socializer or a driver. But I think really what it comes down to, I've seen all of them be successful in business. I think it comes down to more of the grit score that Angela Duckworth talks about in her book of just like, can somebody Have a problem solver, get it done. Winning mentality. And then use their strengths for them. So for example, the other day, let's talk landscaping. I had a guy come to my house and he spoke zero English, and he's like, just this 300 pound Mexican dude. And he just hands me his landscaping. He goes, trees?

He was knocking doors.

Yeah, just knocking doors where most of those landscapers are just leaving a card or, uh, a flyer, right. Hoping that I would call. And he knocks my door. And of course you knock my door. I buy anything. So I'm like, oh, stavien aguas. So he's like, oh, thank you so much. But I was like, you know what? That was the best pitch in the freaking planet today. And he's like, really? And I was like, yeah, can I film your pitch? Will you do it again for me? And he's like, trees, trees. And I film it and I sent it to a couple of my landscape buddies and a turf company I consult and I go, um, I go, uh, hey, this pitch was better than a lot of your guys pitch today. Yeah, because it was an actual, like he was out there. I think that's the problem. He knocked and they. I'm pushing on him and tying and they're like looking for some magic funnel and some crazy phone call to come and call them. And I go, that guy's pitch was much better than your pitch today. Yeah, we don't need to overcomplicate it. He got my business. He. He trimmed my trees and he was out there.

That's freaking awesome. Imagine like just like doing out of body for a second. Like, if you, if you were to knock on someone's door, like, go knock on Sam Taggart's door. You know what I mean? Like the king of door knocking trees.

Like, I'm like, I have one rule. You gotta knock my. Like, I'm like, even as long as you give me a decent pitch, I'll make you pitch me. But I'll buy, you know, so don't

Google that's how I am. Because I knock doors too. It's like if, if they, if they, if they're. If they have the courage to knock, I'll always give them some feedback. I'm like, okay, man, that was really weak.

But yeah, like, yeah, like rewind that. I'll let you try it again. I've done that many times. I'm like, all right, let me give you a couple pointers. Here's my book. But I'm gonna have you do it one more time. So just pretend I. I didn't.

That's awesome. Well, um, I've, I've really admired, like, how you grew your business. When you started. It was. When you started this company, like, was your vision bigger than where it is now? Is it smaller? Like, how did you go from like, okay, I want to do this thing to actually build it? I mean, how many, how many people you got in your office there?

Now we got like 50 employees.

That's. That's huge, right? So, like, how do you, how do you go from Sam Taggart the visionary to like building a company? Because a lot of people struggle with

that, you know, That's a good question. So let's start with the vision, right? I'm sitting on a rock in the desert and on a three day fast meditation and God says you should start a conference. And that's how we started Door to Doorcon. Well, now that new vision has started 10 years in, we're now on our 10th door to Doorcon this January 29th and 30th, and we're actually hosting the lighting experience at that for permanent lighting specifically. Um, where we're collabing with you and some other cool people, like Omni. Um, but like, part of this was I'm sitting there going, I've never been to a conference, let alone gone to it. Like, how do I host one? Right? Like, so it's like I have a vision and I am like, zero how I get on Facebook. And I'm like, we're throwing an event. We don't know what it's called. What do you guys think we should call it? And of course you come up with Door to Door Con. Like there's a doxing more on there. Because a lot of people.

It just sounds so bad.

Yeah, it sounds bad. Like, oh, fetch. Are they conning? Like, I'm like, damn it. But it still makes sense. It's a conference, okay, like fitcon, whatever. Damn it. Um, long story short, we just do it. You know, I have no idea. My mom is my registration. I'm painting freaking foam letters in the basement the night before, trying to like make sure they dry so they can go on stage. You know, I had never, like, I don't know what I'm doing. But I think the vision was pure. And this is what, what I learned about it that day. So it was January 2018, first year, and we had 800 people show up. And my mission was to unify up level, bring honor, integrity to the door to door space. And I said, it needs a better wrap Because I'm sure a lot of landscapers and permanent lighting guys are looking around here going, what the hell? I have a permanent lighting company that's in my mastermind. And they're a bunch of 21 year old kids and they're averaging around 200,000 a week and that's like their fourth month in business and knocking over. And then you have this 40 year old dude that has three degrees in MBAs and he's averaging 200,000 a year. And I'm like, it's so effective, you know what I mean? Because they're out there, right? And so long story short, um, I realized the visionary is now my demise. Because 10 years down the road you keep seeing problems and you're like, oh, I know I can fix that. So we start a recruiting company, a training company, a mastermind of this, an event. We do boot camps every month. We now have an M and A and a roll up and a strategic equity going on. And we'll have, you know, and it just becomes this problem of you just see how, man. I got an idea. I have a team we can execute. I uh, have marketing, I uh, have sales, I have all the admin, I have software and I could just duplicate that. Now you end up with a bat like a pregnant cat because you've got like this thing that comes in and now you're like, oh. So the problem with my archetype is I'm so high visionary and execute, winning, go do what it all takes, get it done. The struggle for types like me, and maybe you're that kind of person, is now just picking one focus. Where some people, they have the fear or the insecurity or the maybe the strategy is not their strength, but they're willing to do the same thing every day. Tell me what to do and I'll go make it happen. And so when you pair up or you even get a coach that's maybe a little bit of a strategist and a vision, now all of a sudden you're like, cool, I'll just run the playbook and execute, combine those teams together and all of a sudden you got a, you got a business. So I have an awesome team. I've hired really good people, but trust me, I've been through many rounds of fires, many mess ups, many like, damn it, shouldn't have hired that guy. You know what I mean? Like, uh, it is a roller coaster for sure.

Well, it's cool to see. Um, uh, it honestly is because I've never had a business over like 15 employees. You know, and I don't know that that's how I measure success per se, but I, uh, do notice that like you can only go so far on your own, you know, and naturally the bigger companies have more employees. So in some instance, it is a measure of success of at least that business, you know.

Well, here's like a shift for this. So I didn't realize. So Utah, I come from Vivint. I was number one rep of 3,000 salespeople, uh, let alone employees. They sold for two point something billion to Blackstone when I was there. They sold NRG like massive, all door to door. And I go to a roofing convention and I'm my very first time speaking there. And it was like, raise your hand if you have more than 100 reps. Nobody raised their hand more than 50. Nobody raised their hand more than 20. Nobody raised their hand 10. A couple of people raised their hand five. I'm like, what the hell? Like I couldn't have been even qualified to manage a sales team if I had less than 15 people. Does that make sense? They would have like partnered with somebody else and been like, oh, you're not there yet. And then I got a huge convention where I'm like, name me if you have more than four people in your company. And it is like window washer that has his washer dude and landscaper that's got his boat homie and lighting guy that's just kind of a solopreneur. And I was like, what the hell? These are phenomenal industries. But I think they haven't tapped into the perception or almost like it's like they've never swam in a different pond than seen at a bigger opportunity and getting beyond kind of this like micro little mom pa landscaper guy. And I'm like, dude, when I was 14, I had my own landscaping business that was probably as big as mo, you know what I mean? Like, like a 14 year old can do that. Let's grow out of that for a minute and like grow something. You know what I mean? Like build a client base, build a fricking business, have multiple crews. Like, I hope if there's one thing you can think about, like, I think this industry that you kind of serve thinks a little too small.

Yeah. Is that what you think the biggest thing is? It's just, they just have. They don't know what's possible.

And I don't think they know how to price and sell to have a margin big enough to then build an actual organization. They're thinking like, uh, really, the omnis of the world is like wholesale price per linear foot. And then it's like, great, what's my take home? I need to get on this job and I'm happy versus no. What's the take home on this job need to be for me to run a business that has employees, manager, sales rep, commission, marketing spend that then can keep this business alive. Not like, what's just my gross profit. And that's as far as I can think.

Yeah, no, you're right. I mean, they treat it much. I mean, they say it's a business, but it's a job. They reverse engineer it in their head of like, okay, how can I make 100 grand and get it?

It's like I need to sell 100 widgets a year based on my gross profit margin. And that's as far as they think. And I'm like, well then how do you hire a manager and a sales rep in that stack and make them 100 grand a year and you 100 grand a year and pay the admin that does customer success and pay the marketing spend to give them lead, like whatever that is. Right. I'm not a market. I'm gonna just go hustle muscle. So we've helped this lighting guy, O, he's a painter guy. I got a text yesterday. This is a great one. Um, you know, painters think that way too, because they're kind of the sales rep and the painter. You know what I mean? Like, they're, they're kind of like a one one group shop. And we hired him in the last 30 days. A couple sales guys through Recruit O Matic and I got a text. I want to, I don't want to misquote it because it came, um, but he said, uh, gilded. It's a lame name. No offense. If you're listening to this, Gilded Painting launched their program September 1st. It is now October 1st or 2nd, um, or whenever this comes out. But have collected 32,000 from their DDD setter team alone that they literally had never door knocked, never, uh, had reps. It was just him guy named Bill. It's like, you know, he goes and builds a canvassing team that we recruited for him. We built the training for him, and now he just did $32,000 more. And I'm like, that's infinitely scalable. He just needs to get more canvassers versus like you put more money in ad spend. It doesn't infinitely scale like in your market necessarily or your serviceable area that you're wanting to play in.

Yeah, I think. And I want to talk about door knocking next, but I. You. I think before we get there, like you said, I think I don't think people are thinking big enough. So it's like, if someone doesn't want to grow anyway, like, they're not going to listen to a new strategy or a new idea. And I think that's why it's. I feel like, uh, I think this is why I'm so passionate about this industry, is because I used to be at that level, too. I remember starting my business and then just trying to make enough money to pay the bills. And then I read the book E Myth and I was like, what the heck? Like, dude, that unlocked everything for me. And then I be. And I became an entrepreneur. I didn't know. I thought an entrepreneur was just like, out hustling someone. You know, it's like, I'll just work more hours and make more money, but, like, that's just a job, not a business. And so I was able to, like, unlock this path for me that I didn't know existed. And so now I'm like, trying to go serve this community. And it's the hardest community to serve, I'm telling you. I'm just telling that to you guys live on this show.

I couldn't go to the huge convention personally this year. I've been. The last two years. I love. I mean, it's a huge convention. We, we and my guys were struggling just because it was like, these don't. These guys can't afford half this growth. Like, they can't think bigger. Like, they don't want more than two guys. Like, it was just like, like selling them more than a single login to our online training of Lighting University or, you know, our. Our sales training. You know, it's like, that's as far as I can think or come to a business boot camp. And then I'm like. But then there's those, like, I could list out, I don't know, 50 off the top of my head that have gone from that one level. Thinker put themselves in a different environment and said, whoa, a widget's a widget. Water filtration, landscaping, solar. It's just a widget. Can I price this with a decent enough margin to scale? That's it.

Yeah. And this is where it gets tough. Specifically with. With permanent lighting, you're going to have more success with that. Landscape lighting is harder because the landscape lighting guys are m. Their identity is more around an artist. And so it's like, well, hold on. Like an artist doesn't sell widgets. An artist is my creativity and my Persona and my ideas and stuff like that. So we have to figure out how to help them understand. It's like you can still be an artist and a successful business owner.

Interior design, kitchen and bath, remodeling, basement siding, even, those all are design artistry and landscapers. Where do you want your trees? How do you want to do this rock, riverbed, shit? Like, all of that is creative. I think with AI, I think with templating, you know, I have a turf company that we've scaled from 0 to I think they'll do 35 million their third year this year. And we dabbled with other alternatives from concrete to landscaping, etc. And we just realized like, man, it's so much easier to scale just turf, right? Do they do some concrete landscape jobs, things like that? It's just auxiliary. But the more we can sell more simple bundles and try to take out less the creative artistry and. Or use some simple AI frameworks, tools, design systems to make your sales process easier. It's much more trainable. It's much more scalable. And that's where I think people get stuck, is they don't have the tool and, or system or packaging to know how to train somebody else to be the artist.

Yeah, 100%. Well, um, okay, so, uh, we got it. We got to take a quick break. We started this new segment. Okay. Because what I want to do is it's a little game we're going to play called you make the call. And it's just a little fun thing. It has nothing to do with lighting or business or anything like that. Um, but it's a new segment. It's powered by call Source. They're a new partner of ours. So, um, what they do is do outbound call center. So most people suck at follow up. So they'll just do all your follow ups for you. Really awesome. So if you guys want to try them out, it's try.callsource. com lfp try.callsource. com LFP it's in the show notes. But Sam, do you want to play? You make the call?

Yeah.

All right, so let's just say you're going on your favorite vacation this weekend. Mountain cabin or beach house?

Mountain cabin for sure.

Oh, nice. All right, where would that be?

That's the hard, like, is it a vacation? So probably like. Yeah, Donner. Like, uh, like Donner Lake Tahoe vibes.

All right, cool. Um, is there a bucket list place you haven't been yet. Like, in the world where you're just like, you know what? I want to go there.

Israel. Uh, Cappadocia, Mountain bike down, like the hot air balloon vibes.

Okay, let's make it happen. Let's do it. Um, all right. Food. Mexican or barbecue?

Mexican.

All right. Mexican or steak?

Steak.

Steak or sushi?

Sushi.

Wow. We got. We got all the way there. Okay, that's awesome. Where's the best sushi in Salt Lake?

I mean, you've got to go mint. Mint, in my opinion, is my favorite. It's right down the street from our office. I mean, there's a couple now, but that was the first one. Um, I like, um, Takashi. Downtown is probably the best.

I've been to, uh, Wasabi and Draper, and then downtown, we go to, uh, Sapa.

Sapa is the other one's good. It's okay. It's. It's fair.

Yeah. Um, how about for books? Do you prefer actually reading or listening?

Both, depending on the book. I'll usually have two books or three books going on at the same time, but I actually like reading. I read every day. I like a physical book. I'd say, if I had to, I'd read.

Yeah. Okay. Do you got a favorite book that you would like? You're just. If you could pick one book.

Uh, Awareness by Anthony Damelo.

Nice. I haven't even heard of that one.

It's the best.

Cool. Um, what's your favorite music genre?

Uh, depends on the mood. I like, like, NF or Dax. Like, kind of that, like, motivational rap vibes. I also like, like, acoustic, kind of the Jack Johnsony chill, mellow vibe.

Just depends, like, how. On a scale of 1 to 10, 0 being none, 10 being, like, extremely hippie, where would you put yourself?

8.

Yeah. Okay. That's cool. You got that, like, cool vibe about you, for sure.

Way more hippie than you think. I mean, I'm not, like, worshiping crystals every night, but, like, definitely energy stuff. You know what I mean?

Yeah.

Like, this morning, I did a 45 minute meditation. It took me m to, like, outer space. Like.

Yes. That's awesome. I know.

I was like, if my wife comes down, she'd be like, where are you? I'm just gone.

Wait, she's not in on this. She doesn't partake so early.

She's asleep.

Okay. Um, you got a favorite walkout song or what would be your walkout song for the next show?

Um, I call it the Hum, and it's like a Jordan Belfort.

Okay. Yeah. Is that what you do? Do you have your own?

Yeah, yeah, it's called. What's called the hum. And. And then I started making my own on Suno. So this last door to door kind of made a whole freaking door to door con, you know, Suno playlist that was all custom music to like each industry. So maybe I'll make a lighting one this year, you know, can't wait. Pretty dope. All right.

Tennis, uh, shoes or dress? Shoes?

Tennis shoes.

Recruit, uh, for talent or attitude? We got some business ones now.

Uh, bad. Uh, both. I don't know that one. I am a, I am a talent hunter. Um, I actually lose patience and, and I know how to recruit talent. I think a lot of people don't know how to recruit talent. Where I think that's what makes me good is like I have a big network of talent, so I can just sell them easily and it's faster.

Yeah. Okay, cool. Morning, uh, blitz or evening? Blitz?

Morning blitz for sure.

Really? I was, I was kind of expecting you, say, evening.

Are you talking about knocking or just

like getting done knocking?

Oh, uh, evening for sure. Saturdays and evenings. All right. Unless you're selling old people, you know, I mean, I don't know, permanent lighting, they might like that. You know what I mean?

Yeah, that's true. Big, uh, market or small town?

Small town. All the guys, I'm telling you, you go own a little town of 2,000 people, you could go get all of them.

Very cool. Because the people in the small town want the big market

and they, and they just. Once one person gets it, they all want it. You know what I mean? Go sell the mayor of the town and it's game over all.

Uh, right. Commission only or base plus commission?

Great question. Uh, so commission only. I mean, I wrote the book. You, you killed. The problem is, is if you're recruiting on. Indeed. And your only strategy is that then I would recommend having some kind of base. You're going to get a higher applicant flow. Um, and we have data. I mean, we spent a million dollars this year on ads for recruitomatic. So like we recruit for what, 90 companies. So the data is the guys that have a commission job tend to get more people in the door. But if I'm going after talent, I'm just gonna go commission only. It's like ewee kill.

Cool. That's, that's great. I think just to have that perspective because you hear people like you say, like, oh, commission only. But there is a, a time and a place to give someone a base.

I do like kind of a 30 day or a 14 day pilot. Like, they don't know this, but I'm like, I'll know whether I need to keep you or not within 14 to 30 days. And it's like a hard and fast. Like you have to have a backbone if you're going to do a base.

All right, that was it. That was, uh, you make the call. Thanks for playing, Sam.

That's fun. I like that.

Yeah, mix it up. It's kind of fun because I just learned stuff about you I didn't know. So, um. All right, but we are going to go back because I really want to get into the door knocking philosophy if we have time, maybe even talk some recruiting. Um, why do you think or do you think is door knocking the greatest marketing and sales process ever?

Um, yes, for everybody in this audience in its own sense. You're not going to compete with the big box, you know what I mean? And I doubt maybe, I don't know. The Jellyfish Lighting owner is listening to this podcast. I'm assuming most of the people listening are small entrepreneurs that are trying to scale their business. And the problem is every marketer is going to sell you a bag of hopes and dreams. They're going to be like, oh, give me 50 grand for SEO and I'll turn you to number one. And can you do that? Sure. It's just expensive, you know what I mean? And so I think, like, until you've built up enough cash flow and confidence, why, why go throw money at that? And what ends up happening is people go and spend money on ads and they don't even know if they're good at selling. And now they're converting at a low percentage, which is now costing their, like their creation cost now goes way up. Because when you go one for eight and or the sales guy you. You thought was good is not good, but you don't know how to even audit that. Like, why not fumble on free, you know what I mean? It just costs you time and energy. Where it's not the greatest is it's. You're now in the people management business. You know, you're in this game of emotional my dog ate my homework and I my grandma's are dead in flat tires and shit. Like, it's just you're herding cats, you know what I mean? So the problem is, it's like, if you can't lead yourself first though, then how the heck are you supposed to lead somebody else? And so I tell people in this audience, I'm like, what if you just put everything aside of running the business as everybody's going to make some excuse and, uh, just wouldn't knock for a week. Like just 100%, 8 to 10 hours a day, Everything you had just to. Just to see what happens.

Because, uh, even if it's to prove that it doesn't work right, Exactly.

Just give it one full week. Not a day, not a couple hours, not a Saturday. I'm talking eight to ten hours every day. No matter the outcome. You might get some appointments, you might not. You might, same day, close. I don't care what you're doing. It's just gorilla yourself to prove something to yourself. And then watch. You may love it, you may hate it, you may know how to duplicate it. You're like, oh, yeah, okay, I see what people need now. But I think some people in this industry don't even know if they're good or not. At closing, because I went out my first day in lighting. I took jellyfish out to Houston, and they paid me a lot of money to kind of build out their training. We recruit for them. We did all their video, like, you know what I mean? The awesome group. And I went and knocked at the owner. The owner was like, I want to go see you do it. And I was like, I've never done it, but I'll try. The first door I knock, I sold. He was like, mind blown. I set an appointment for later because his wife was there. But like, two hours later, I went back when his wife got home from work, and. And he's like, I've never seen a close that smooth fast. And I was like, well, I've never done lighting, so I don't even know

what I'm doing yet.

I don't even know what I'm doing. He's like, holy crap. And we got it all on film and put it in lighting training. But, like, what? He did not know running an $80 million lighting company, he did not know that sales process. And I go, I wonder how much money you could have been having, how much leads and how many customers had every one of your people been trained like this? And he was like, I don't even want to think about that. That makes me want to throw up. You know what I mean? Like, that was the conversation. And I was just like, yeah, you can just spend a ton of money on marketing, but you're going to catch something, you know, obviously. But it's just going to get expensive, potentially.

So you're saying that, um. Yeah, you don't. You don't have the risk of marketing potentially not working. It also is a great way to test your sales process. Like, test your skills. Like, see if you're even. See if it can uncover some holes in your current process. You know, it's interesting because I didn't even. Like, when I started my lighting business, my first thought wasn't necessarily knocking doors. Um, I was. But I did because I didn't have any money. And so, like, we were fortunate to land a job. A friend of ours was a landscaper. Really nice neighborhood. And all I knew was how to knock doors. Because that was like, I had done that before. And so I knocked the doors. And I didn't have training from Sam Taggart. I didn't have, like. I didn't know what to say. I've never sold outdoor lighting door to door either. And I just said, hey, we're, you know, the Benson's down the street, we're doing the lighting for them. We actually can even set up a free demo and just show you what it looks like. Even if you don't even buy from us. We don't even care. But at least so you could see what you're missing out on. I sold a $25,000 job, like, on the spot. And then I another one. They were like, you know, traveling out of town, whatever. But it was about two months later, ended up selling them at 25,000. We ended up doing this whole neighborhood. Not all because I was knocking doors. Sometimes it was referrals, all that. But I think.

But you got your foot in the door and you got momentum.

Yeah.

And I think targeted your demographic of what you wanted to sell your bigger ticket.

Yeah. And you're exactly. You're already in that neighborhood at a minimum. And I actually do like your idea, so I don't want to like, um, like derail that idea. But like, I would say, at a minimum, if you're getting a job, why are you not knocking those doors around?

Minimum. That's where I was going to go next is it's like, okay, you get a lead, it cost you $1,000. And that, uh, was your creation cost. Well, if I can go get two of the neighbors or three referrals from it, we teach a warm referral market strategy. One of my coaches, he did 20 years in Cutco. And so what he does is he goes into companies that maybe don't have the same hustle muscle that the Utah Mormon missionary return guys that, you know what I mean? Like, you culturally see door to door, it's normal here. People are not like you do door to door for you, Ryan, it was like, yeah, like let's just do that. Like it's normal here. But in Georgia it's like people still do that. Like what? Like, you know what I mean? And to us it's culturally accepted. Where what I say is, it's like, okay, let's work on a referral game that is tracked, measured. And I remember I recruited a bunch of Cutco guys to my Vivint team. And he's like, Sam, imagine you couldn't knock a door. Like do what you do, but you're not allowed to knock a door. So vector marketing, which was Cutco Knives, they didn't allow you to paste ads on marketing and they didn't let you go door knock. So the only way you could do business was through warm referrals. And they would average 20 to 30 referrals from every single customer. That's how the good reps worked. Then they had these massive lists of names. And so uh, this week one of my, this Mike guy who's 20 years in Cutco, he went to Bob's Roofing and Gutters and let me see what he just sent. So he just sent me a text, he goes, I train their. Oh, H vac. Just kidding. They have an H Vac division and uh, roofing and gutters. And he says he trained them on the referral script. They had six customers give a total of 24 referrals written on sheets of paper. And this is just like his little message he sent yesterday. And basically it's like the first time they ever tried it with only talking to six of their customers. They got 24 names. Now they go to those names. Do you think those are better leads than some random door or do you think those are better leads than even. Probably even a click?

You know, are uh, those referrals that then they're gonna call or go knock

on their door, they're gonna get a group message from the customer saying, hey, this is my H Vac guy, he changed my life. Go hear him out.

Love it. That's cool.

I'd way rather have that than a cold door. Yeah. And so it's like we teach these methodologies that are more carnivore based, which that would be in that category because it cost $0.

Mhm.

Maybe a $50 high five. You know what I mean? Like so to me it's how do we embody a new method that isn't so wait for my phone to ring. But it's creating business from the business that's sitting in front of us.

All right, so I'm going to explain my thoughts, and I don't feel like I'm going to reveal anything new to you, but I just want to, like, get my thoughts out there for the audience and you to know where I'm coming from. I feel like the human brain is literally just designed to keep us safe. We're just supposed to be cavemen. Stay in the. Stay safe in the cave. And we're not supposed to be. Or I'm not saying we're not supposed to be, but our brain is not designed to be an entrepreneur. It's not designed to take risks. It's not designed to go knock doors. It's not designed to ask referrals. There's a lot of people that think that door to door, selling used cars, asking for referrals. They. They view it as this, like, dirty, like, I was just a natural thing.

I would disagree is that you don't think they.

You don't think they feel like that.

I, uh, don't. I think we were designed the other way. I just think society keeps domesticating itself. Think about it. From the earliest days, we had to go hunt or else we didn't eat.

Yeah.

Like, we had to go to war or else we would get slaughtered by the enemy. Like, in the world today, do you just go to CVS and nobody's sitting there threatening your family's life and chasing you out of a town? Like, the society has created softness through just. We built life with AI even now saying, well, AI will just write the slides for me in this speech and AI will just do the thing for me. I mean, it's even getting worse.

Well, the reason I say, like, the brain's designed to keep us safe is because, like, as an entrepreneur, we. We have, like, abundant mindsets. Like, the most successful entrepreneurs are as a, uh, as like a caveman, I'll call it my caveman Persona or whatever. Like, we are going to go out and kill because, like, that's what's going to keep us safe. Like, we have to provide for our family if we have to go to war. Like, we will, but, like, the natural tendency is to, like, go do that and then come back, bring your food, eat it in the cave. Like, we're not gonna be out here, like, in the law. That's what I mean is like. Yes, but to be, like, a killer, to, like, be successful, to, like, to win the war, to provide for your family, you. You gotta go out and kill. And most people aren't willing to do that. They. Their brain. I think it's their brain. I don't know what it is. That's what I'm wondering. Something's holding them back. They make up these stories about why I'm not going to go knock doors, why I'm not going to ask my customer for referrals, because that just seems slimy to me. They make up these stories to protect themselves in their current environment.

It's conditioning, which is sad. It's almost like don't talk to strangers has been beaten into us. And I'm like, what a terrible society to live in when it's breeded into us. What do you mean? Like don't socialize with random people that like make their day. Like, like, what does that even mean? Like they're going to what, like rape you? Like, uh, it's just like the problem is we've been almost anti conditioned to what really should be. And that's like why I wrote eat what you kill was because I'm sitting there going, how do I help these people get back to the roots of we're actually social beings, we're meant to go talk to random people, we're meant to go build, we're meant to go hunt. It's just we're now we're helicoptering our kids to where they never learned that, you know what I mean? We're like my kid on Monday when I made $120 as a 10 year old in 3 hours cleaning garbage cans in the neighborhood. He wanted $100 pair of pants. I said, we'll go figure it out.

Mhm.

Where most parents would be like, you can't go do that. That's annoying. You're gonna bug the neighbors. I'm like, right? They got that. They got it. Go figure it out. You know what I mean? And he makes 120 bucks in his 10 year old in an hour. You know, I mean it's like good for him. He had to learn the dopamine hit of I can. And I think we've been dis, we've been enabled or disempowered by, you know, school, by jobs in the past that had disempowered the real entrepreneur. Because when you go from a W2 mindset into starting your own business, it's a scary leap, right? But the problem is if you don't deconstruct or rebuild your own mentality going into business where luckily I just never had the, I never had to deconstruct anything. It was just since the beginning of time I only knew eat what you kill. So it was easy for me. But like, most people go a decade and then they're like, effing it. I've had it with this dump. But they're still looking for the safety net of somebody else writing their paycheck.

Yeah, well, I'm hoping that someone's listening to this going, okay, well, like, I agree with that. Like, I'm gonna do something different. So let's say we convince someone to be like, hey, I'm gonna take Sam up on his deal here. I'm gonna. Because, like, if. If you just took that a week off to go knock doors, you're like, you're gonna be fine. You're not. Your world's not gonna end, life's not gonna end. Maybe you have a customer that's mad at you. Something like that, you know, but like, anyone can go do this. Um, give us a couple tips. Like, I know that you have a whole training and academy and process and stuff like that, but just a couple pointers for them to not totally eff it up on the doors.

So very simple. And I'm just going to call it the three steps. I have a five step door approach, but just very simple. Who you are, what you're doing and why you're there, then transition. If you don't ask for the sale, you're never going to get it. Um, and if you let your schedule be the boss, because it's going to naturally you're going to go and get all this anxiety. Oh, man, what if they say no and where do I go? And you're going to drive around neighborhoods for three extra hours and it's like, just park the car. Like, drop a pin in a neighborhood and park the car and run out the door and say, I can't get back in the car for another five hours or seven hours or whatever the time is. So park the car, run to the first door and start. The hardest part is your car door. And getting out of that is actually scarier and harder than even the first door. Now you get your face kicked in. Get the first no. Say, all I want you to do is tell me no. Knock your first door and be like, give me no.

Just plan for a no.

I need to get a no out of you. And they're like, what? Please, right here, give it to me first, right here. I need to get my first no out of the day. Now all of a sudden it's like,

oh, that might work, actually. Yeah, it's actually genius.

I promise you, it's very. There's a lot more psychology to that too. Hey, you're my first door. Just tell me no, I need to get my first no out of the day. And then I feel good about myself. Just like a pitcher. Hey, throw a couple warm up pitches. Like, okay, you threw it, you threw a ball. Good job. Um, and, uh, then you go to the next door and guess what? After a few doors, you're like, okay, and guess what, what if your goal is to just get 50 no's a day instead of trying to have a goal to get one yes. And all of a sudden, if you know 50 no's that could lead into one yes. Like, what if it's, I just got to get one no a day. I got to get 15 no's a day or some kind of number. Right? And it just means you're putting in the input because the reality is most people fake. They fake the inputs. Oh, I knocked today. No, you were in your out of the office for eight hours. You did not knock today.

I talked to 15 people. They all told me no. So no one's ever going to be interested.

Yeah, just like, just get out there and try that. You know what I mean? And then don't give, uh, up. And I think if you invested in some training and some tools and some scripting, you can get better and better. I had a kid in permanent lighting in California. They came to my sales boot camp last month. And then the owner, Shem, came to my boot camp last week and he's like, bro, those kids that came to your event, they just got their first two permanent lighting deals. Um, and it was the week of I got to send him a text because I told him I'd send this guy a video of like, congrats, because that first deal is the hardest deal. Once you sold one, you know you can sell too. And his two brand new rookies we helped him recruit had got their first sales. And I'm like, proof is there. Now how do you get two now? How do you get three now? It's cool.

Very cool. That's awesome. Well, um, I'm really hoping someone takes you up on this challenge. Uh, I, I almost don't want to give them the out of, like, at least knock the door.

Tag me every day. Here's the way you do it.

Do this.

I'm gonna commit to a week. We're gonna call it the, the knock for a week challenge. One week knock challenge or something. Hashtag tag me on DDD Experts or the Sam Taggart on Instagram. And I'll share your journey and I'll follow along on your journey or something. And it's like I'm your accountability at this point. And it's like day one of my week of knocking challenge. And just use me as your now accountability. Who's watching you? And I'd be happy to do that. And then I hope you guys come out to the Lighting Experience in January and, you know, maybe see some. Open your eyes, expose yourself to maybe a different community. Because I have pest control guys that'll sell a million dollars of pest control in four months. And the ticket price is 600,000 bucks. Like they're. My nephew went out in six weeks his junior year of high school and did $150,000 of pest control. Like, if you guys can't, like, it's. To me, I think there's a world in which you, um, there's a. It's not as complicated as you think. It's more just. Do you have the hustle and willingness to go get your face kicked in?

Yeah. Very cool. All right, so tell us, uh, as we wrap up here, how people get a hold of you that you just said they can follow you on Instagram or on Facebook. Uh, d2d con, the lighting experience in Salt Lake City. Give us the dates and all the info.

Yeah, so January 29th and 30th, lighting experience. We just locked in campaigns. Tony Hawk. Um, we got, uh, some awesome keynotes and it'll be a really cool experience with six breakouts on permanent lighting and how to sell it and how to build that business. Um, and yeah, just look up Lighting Experience, um, or Door to Door Con or Lighting University. We've got all sorts of resources to help anybody in that space.

Awesome, man. Thanks for coming on the show. Uh, awesome nuggets. Thanks for sharing a little bit of your story, your journey and inspiring us. Um, someone's gonna go out there and start knocking doors and have like a ten million dollar summer. Um, it's totally possible. The average ticket's good size. It's going to be dope. That Golden Door is gonna be like, oh, I remember doing that in a week. So, uh, so many possibilities. Thanks a lot.

I appreciate you so much. Okay, we'll see you guys. Yeah. Million dollars or what is it? 1.5 this year is Golden Door for Lighting. So we have an award for it even. It's freaking awesome.

Knock that out in a couple weeks, you know what I mean?

I know. I've seen people do it. A couple weeks. Okay. All right. We'll see you, man.

All, uh, right, guys, take it easy. Go take Sam up on his challenge. Tag Sam, tag me. Make some videos on there, and, like, I'll give you live feedback on what you should be doing. So tag us in there. Thanks so much, guys. Have a great week.

Okay, I gotta jump. I'm late for the next one later.